Hi Scott.
We got no answers from you on:
danielv@netvision.net.il wrote:
Hi Guides (fellow Squeakers in the audience? ;-)
Three issues we should start moving on, IMO:
- Process to take physical ownership of updates.
- Scott/SqC - do you have any remaining agenda for 3.4a/3.2.1, to
settle before handing over the "keys"?
- Scott, are you interested in some role (as vaguely ;-) postulated by
goran, or otherwise) under the guidance (sic) of us Guides?
- If neither of the above, can you explain the current existing tools
in the image for handling this and the required resources, so we can plan a clean transition?
How do you prefer to proceed?
And if the last, then on the technical side -
I assume basically we'll need some public readable, Guides writeable storage space on updates.squeakfoundation.org, and a final update on both all current servers and versions that changes the urls currently in the image. Am I missing something?
Daniel
At 12:52 AM +0300 11/16/02, danielv@netvision.net.il wrote:
Hi Scott.
We got no answers from you on:
I apologize for not replying sooner, but I hope you'll find the wait has been worthwhile ;-)
Three issues we should start moving on, IMO:
- Process to take physical ownership of updates.
- Scott/SqC - do you have any remaining agenda for 3.4a/3.2.1, to
settle before handing over the "keys"?
The Guides have the "keys" already, in the sense that no updates are being published by SqC without the prior approval of the Guides.
Having said that, I should add that I had been willing and intending and expecting to take responsibility to drive Squeak 3.4 quickly forward, right the way through to final release within the next month -- a "unification" release that could reunite the community; the last monolithic image, the last SqC image, a solid basis from which the SqueakMap culture could start to form and from which forthcoming image refactoring and stripping could start taking place in Squeak 3.5a in a matter of weeks.
Indeed, I had been thinking of it as something that SqC *owed* to the community, after this difficult year.
This is a lot of work, people -- stressful, exacting, time-consuming, uncelebrated, unpaid. Thus, the sudden prospect of immediate, complete freedom from such responsibilities is very enticing. So I accept ;-)
If the preference and mood of the community are for an immediate and unconditional and complete hand-over to the Guides, today, right now, of responsibility for 3.4 (and for all Squeak versions for that matter,) consider it done. The keys are in the ignition, guys, go ahead and drive it off ;-)
- Scott, are you interested in some role (as vaguely ;-) postulated by
goran, or otherwise) under the guidance (sic) of us Guides?
Yes, I'm willing to serve a bridging role. If the Guides want to send me fileouts for publication as updates, I'll gladly publish them; this would afford the full effect of a hand-off while not for the moment requiring us to change too many other things all at once.
- If neither of the above, can you explain the current existing tools
in the image for handling this and the required resources, so we can plan a clean transition?
Well, this communication needs to be done in any case. I will explain everything I know, but Dan is the best person to transmit most of this information -- they're his tools, and his procedures, and he is the person of record on the sites, guardian of the passwords, contact person with uiuc, etc. Ted is the other leading expert and insider in these matters.
And if the last, then on the technical side -
I assume basically we'll need some public readable, Guides writeable storage space on updates.squeakfoundation.org, and a final update on both all current servers and versions that changes the urls currently in the image. Am I missing something?
Sounds like you're on top of it. Good luck!
Cheers,
-- Scott
Hi Scott,
I would really appreciate it if you, and Squeak Central, take the responsibility to drive Squeak 3.4 quickly forward to closure. This would indeed make a nice end-point for the SqC sponsored series of releases before the Guides take over. If this does not happen, then Squeak 3.2-4956 will become that end-point by default. Moreover, this cuts the Mousekeepers a little slack to better organize their excellent work.
Cheers, Roger.....
On Saturday, Nov 16, 2002, at 00:47 America/Denver, Scott Wallace wrote:
[snip]
The Guides have the "keys" already, in the sense that no updates are being published by SqC without the prior approval of the Guides.
Having said that, I should add that I had been willing and intending and expecting to take responsibility to drive Squeak 3.4 quickly forward, right the way through to final release within the next month -- a "unification" release that could reunite the community; the last monolithic image, the last SqC image, a solid basis from which the SqueakMap culture could start to form and from which forthcoming image refactoring and stripping could start taking place in Squeak 3.5a in a matter of weeks.
Indeed, I had been thinking of it as something that SqC *owed* to the community, after this difficult year.
This is a lot of work, people -- stressful, exacting, time-consuming, uncelebrated, unpaid. Thus, the sudden prospect of immediate, complete freedom from such responsibilities is very enticing. So I accept ;-)
If the preference and mood of the community are for an immediate and unconditional and complete hand-over to the Guides, today, right now, of responsibility for 3.4 (and for all Squeak versions for that matter,) consider it done. The keys are in the ignition, guys, go ahead and drive it off ;-)
[snip]
(Trying to dig through the traffic here)
Let me be short and to the point, there are far too many long posts to read anyway:
I would like you Scott to stay on the job (if you want to) until the Guides have learned the ropes etc. Daniel's posting sounded IMHO a bit "provocative" :-), but as he later replied that was unintentional. Personally I am not sure if we are fully prepared to take over right *now* - there are so many things happening so it would feel much better to be able to lean a bit on you for a while. :-)
But I would very much like Doug and you to start with two things:
1. Document the current process. 2. Together make a sketch for a new process. (and I would gladly help out with this)
Daniel is already leading a thread forward about what 3.4 should/could contain.
regards, Göran
(Catching up on a few older emails)
Scott Wallace wrote:
... If the preference and mood of the community are for an immediate and unconditional and complete hand-over to the Guides, today, right now, of responsibility for 3.4 (and for all Squeak versions for that matter,) consider it done. The keys are in the ignition, guys, go ahead and drive it off ;-)
- Scott, are you interested in some role (as vaguely ;-) postulated by
goran, or otherwise) under the guidance (sic) of us Guides?
Yes, I'm willing to serve a bridging role. If the Guides want to send me fileouts for publication as updates, I'll gladly publish them; this would afford the full effect of a hand-off while not for the moment requiring us to change too many other things all at once.
Based on the discussion so far, I think it's agreed that we'd like you to serve this bridging role through the release of 3.4; that would be great. The updates that you publish would be a combination of:
1. Updates that you & SqC decide to include, which you can quickly run by the Guides before including
2. Fileouts that we Guides agree should be included (items that we harvest, etc.), and that we send to you
Does that sound right?
- If neither of the above, can you explain the current existing tools
in the image for handling this and the required resources, so we can plan a clean transition?
Well, this communication needs to be done in any case. I will explain everything I know, but Dan is the best person to transmit most of this information -- they're his tools, and his procedures, and he is the person of record on the sites, guardian of the passwords, contact person with uiuc, etc. Ted is the other leading expert and insider in these matters.
Sounds good. I guess we will look for this information as we approach the 3.4 release.
- Doug
squeakfoundation@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
danielv＠netvision.net.il -
Doug Way -
goran.hultgren＠bluefish.se -
Roger Vossler -
Scott Wallace