It seems interesting, but still I can't find how to develop for Squeak. Is there a tutorial that explains the differences between Squeak and Java/Python ? I'm feeling really dumb looking at Squeak. Is it all drag & drop ?

I found out that I can drag & drop images (took me ages :), but I really want to make an automated procedure since I have to port around 900 exercises, I don't want to do it by hand...

What should I do to run DrGeoII ? I downloaded an .mcz file, but I can't do anything with it.

I really think there should be a tutorial for content developers on the OLPC platform...

Thanks!

On 7/4/07, Hilaire Fernandes hilaire@ofset.org wrote:

For what you want to do do, the Squeak Morphic interface is probably your best friend. The great benefice of Squeak is to let the user (or teacher) to combine independent user interface elements (Morph) to create very specific pedagogical content. Pierre André Dreyfuss and Suzanne Guyader have created such resources that way. When necessaries these elements can be programmatically glued together with EToys commands. See a few examples they are proposing there: http://ofset.org:8000/super/gallery

The next interesting stage in this Smalltalk-o-Morphic paradigm (=Squeak) is to design additional Morph objects to simulate whatever you want and then use it in whatever Morphic assemblage you want. This is what is Kedama for particle, ODECo for gravity.

Related to geometry, I have developed and recently enhanced DrGeoII, an interactive geometry canvas. You can see from there a screenshot of such a Morphic geometry canvas used in an Squeak-olpc book http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire/?post/2007/06/28/Le-squeak-pour-lOLPC

Hilaire Fernandes

2007/7/3, Orestis Markou orestis@orestis.gr:

...

Hello,

I've downloaded the image of EToys and I'm playing around in my Windows PC, it works quite well.

I want to create EToys projects that will replace the normal exercise texbook. Most of the exercises just need to display the question, provide a space for writing down, and a space for giving the final answer. A few (like geometry) would need tools like a compass and ruler, plus giving names to parts (like naming an edge of a triangle) and so on. Maybe some animation will be used, but no scripting, and there is no concept of grading in an automated sense.

Now, for something like this, I'd use Flash in a web browser, but I've been dictated to use the EToys platform. Is this the correct platform ? Should I develop on EToys or should I drop in squeak ? I'd prefer python to do this, as I'm much more versed in python than smalltalk...

Thanks, Orestis Markou _______________________________________________ Etoys mailing list Etoys@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/etoys

Just want to state my personal experience with all these to our friend Orestis... I used squeak and etoys this February for the first time...The truth is that at start using (and programming in etoys) was a bit frustrating, especially if you are an OO developer or you 've never used a dynamically-typed environment like Smalltalk. My feeling is that the squeak environment is more "loose" than a "traditional" programming environment (like Emacs you said) and this can be both good and bad. For instance, you can disable all keyboard input by commenting a single line in a class browser...i mean that you have the power to do all sorts of low-level things (and mess them up quite much). This is normal for a squeak starter. From my point of view, in general you should consider squeak more like an autonomous operating system than a simple programming environment (i think there was a case where they tried to port in a machine as a sole opertating system, not under a VM). Now in terms of development, smalltalk gives all the power of OO development (you can apply design principles and patterns, do some refactoring etc.) and yet be fun and always handy. Also, for a functional progammer the thing that i believe is most confusing at start is that there are no explicit execution flow control structures (like if, for, while etc.). Yet, all flow control is done by message passing...you can find many useful tutorials as Hilaire proposed that can sort all these things out. You can find a tutorial for java programmers here

http://www.objectsroot.com/squeak/squeak_tutorial.html

helped me a lot at start, cause you can kind of see mapping from java programming to squeak programming.

Starting with some tutorials and creating a few simple examples on your own i believe that will give you a good learning curve in a two months time...

Good luck and have fun...

Christos.

2007/7/6, Orestis Markou orestis@orestis.gr:

...

It seems interesting, but still I can't find how to develop for Squeak. Is there a tutorial that explains the differences between Squeak and Java/Python ? I'm feeling really dumb looking at Squeak. Is

This is a normal felling. Smalltalk is not complicated, it is in fact easier, but first you have to accept a few paradigm shifts: 'image based' vs 'file based', 'pure OO' vs 'mix of functionnal and OO'. What make Smalltlak easier are these paradigm shifts. So for example if you are an Emacs user like me you should forget about it for Smalltalk programming, it is just not applying.

Another important stuff is that most of Squeak is written with itself, you may first think as an anecdote, but the impact is huge: for explorer like you and me it helps to discover how classes and methods are used in other part of the image. Again this paradigm shift help to increase hugely the developer productivity.

A first place you may want to look for Squeak programming is http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak

Regarding the Smalltalk development environment, there are few video tutorials there, take a look it may help you to get an idea about Smalltalk IDE

http://community.ofset.org/wiki/Outils_et_frameworks#Videos_tutorielles

...

it all drag & drop ?

No. What is mainly drag&drop is the end user interface for kid like EToys. Behind the scene it is Smalltalk programming.

...

I found out that I can drag & drop images (took me ages :), but I really want to make an automated procedure since I have to port around 900 exercises, I don't want to do it by hand...

Squeak looks like a good choice for that, but well, you will have to learn programming with it and it may take some time. Why do you want to do that with Squeak if you don't know it?

...

What should I do to run DrGeoII ? I downloaded an .mcz file, but I can't do anything with it.

Hum , under linux I drop the .mcz file in the Squeak running image, then accept "load it" (or something like that, sorry I don't remember the exact name)

Then do a [Allt]+o on the Squeak image, an object distributor will show up, go on the graphic category and drag'n drop the DrGeo icon any where you want to get your geometric canvas.

Of course it is possible to use programmatically, but this is another story.

...

I really think there should be a tutorial for content developers on the OLPC platform...

The Squeak one apply. For example I am writting DrGeoII with Squeak-dev3.9 Oh by the way, if you want to do programming I strongly suggest you to start with the Squeak-dev image the community are maintaining, these version of Squeak come with all the developer extension you want

From http://www.squeak.org/Download/ search for Squeak-dev

Hilaire _______________________________________________ Etoys mailing list Etoys@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/etoys

------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through Greek School Network: http://www.sch.gr/ Το μήνυμα εστάλη μέσω του Πανελλήνιου Σχολικού Δικτύου: http://www.sch.gr/