UI August 2007

ui@lists.squeakfoundation.org

17 participants
27 discussions

Squeak UI guidelines/heuristics
by Brad Fuller 04 Sep '07

04 Sep '07

I'd like to get your ideas on compiling a list of UI guidelines or heuristics that Squeak developers should follow. A few have mentioned they liked the idea, but I'd like to hear from the whole group. Is it a dumb idea or maybe a good one but tough to follow through? Too tough for our first go-round? (which I should mention now: I think we need to find a couple of "jobs" that we can accomplish fairly quickly to provide some success to the group.) If you think it's a good idea, we could discuss one at a time and when we have a statement that we like, we could place it on the squeak wiki on a "Squeak UI Guidelines" page. As I mentioned before, there are already plenty of Squeak UI precedences set and maybe we could start with those that have been successful. Most of the successful ones are ubiquitous and thus sometimes hard to see cuz we're so used to them, (for instance, the fact that you can edit what you see is a basic and powerful attribute of Squeak. No need to go to a special "editor" like a text editor or graphics editor to edit a morphic. ) We could also discuss ideas that others have had, such as Jef Raskin's Humane Interface, and if applicable bring them into our domain. brad

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RE: [UI] Widgets ready
by Gary Chambers 04 Sep '07

04 Sep '07

Think I'll go with Universes (after learning to use it!), now which categories... -----Original Message----- From: Bill Schwab [mailto:BSchwab@anest.ufl.edu] Sent: 29 August 2007 2:58 pm To: gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com; ui(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org Subject: Re: [UI] Widgets ready Gary, I would not presume to describe the best way to release it. I will happily grab it from an arbitrary URL if that is of any help to you. Thanks for making it available! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com 08/29/07 9:45 AM >>> Well, I think the Widgets/UITheme stuff is ready for a first release :-) Tested on a stock 3.9 image, not looked at 3.10 yet... Consists of two Monticello packages: The main "Widgets" package including theme support and Morphic fixes; An extra ToolBuilder package to integrate the new dialogs into the environment (where UIManager is used at any rate, directly or indirectly). Looks nicer with Andy Tween's FreeType packages installed though will work without. Any suggestions as to how people want the packages submitted? My SqueakMap account sadly points to an older email and I've forgotten the password... If people would like a script for setting preferences I can post here. Will repost this on squeak-dev for those not following here! Gary. _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui

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A couple of noteworthy morphic projects
by karl 31 Aug '07

31 Aug '07

During the summer Jérôme Chauveau <http://www.squeaksource.com/@TYePbKFxMifYRsrI/WwBqrnCp?13>, a french student have made great progress on a html/css renderer/viewer. This project is at http://www.squeaksource.com/DomView.html Here is the project description: "This project consist in building a simple web page viewer able to display HTML/CSS contents. For example, a such tool will permit to display mails with HTML code and will be usefull for previewing pages during Seaside application development. The goal is not to build a browser - just a modern HTML/CSS renderer based on http://www.squeaksource.com/htmlcssparser" Another cool project is Skeleton: http://www.languagegame.org:8080/ggame/11 Project description: "Skeleton is a visual scripting environment as an extension of Squeak etoy <http://www.squeakland.org> with Connectors <http://nedkonz.dhs.org:8080/Ned/8> system to make mathematical and physical simulation for non professional computer user. Squeak etoy system is a unique attempt to provide effective way of programming for children in learning environment. Skeleton makes logical relationships among graphical objects in the etoy system with spreadsheets-style interface, and users can describe object’s behavior in declarative representation." Both these projects bring lots of new and exiting possibilities to Squeak. Karl

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Re: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 30 Aug '07

30 Aug '07

I think you are on to something, but that does not work because the 3.9 selector is not recognized. Maybe something in the 3.9 donwnload is not up to date?? Must go home - will be very mad at myself if I don't =:0 More later. Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> tapplek(a)gmail.com 8/29/2007 6:35:51 PM >>> On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 07:29:23PM -0400, Bill Schwab wrote: > Gang, > > Remedial question: I am trying to do a clean install, and I can't get > the universe browser to work. I have downloaded the 3.9 zip file > (windows) from squeak.org, loaded YAXO (over loud notices that it is not > marked as compatible, but saw no other option), then loaded the > universes package. Launch the browser, then getting the list over the > net fails. > > What am I missing? You probably need to set the universe to load from. Try running: UUniverse switchSystemToUniverse: UUniverse squeak39Universe -- Matthew Fulmer -- http://mtfulmer.wordpress.com/ Help improve Squeak Documentation: http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/808 _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui

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Re: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 30 Aug '07

30 Aug '07

Gang, Remedial question: I am trying to do a clean install, and I can't get the universe browser to work. I have downloaded the 3.9 zip file (windows) from squeak.org, loaded YAXO (over loud notices that it is not marked as compatible, but saw no other option), then loaded the universes package. Launch the browser, then getting the list over the net fails. What am I missing? Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029

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RE: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 30 Aug '07

30 Aug '07

Gary, Understood about 6. It would be nice to have control over it, but I am much less concerned about the IDE than what end users would see and have to use. How hard would it be to make the cursor movement controllable by preference? Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com 8/29/2007 2:33 PM >>> 6. The theming only applies to the text editor/entry morphs created via the theme, for compatability for the moment. As for 3., I've kind of got used to the focus-follows-mouse thing. It can be changed, but, as I said, it required (even more) invasive code into Morphic! Personally I'd be happy to do that, preference-based, of course... -----Original Message----- From: ui-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:ui-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf Of Bill Schwab Sent: 29 August 2007 8:22 pm To: ui(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org Subject: RE: [UI] Widgets ready Gary, 1. Fair enough. 2. I don't think it's either, but who knows what I grabbed. The image is a working one from my Ubuntu box. 3. This one hurts. With that said, I am willing to work at making it work; it is one of my main hopes for this group. With much respect for what you have done and gratitude for your sharing it, and for releasing it for us to play with it<g>, tabbing is meaningless if a twitch pushes the mouse and snaps the cursor away. As I said, I will gladly help out if the group agrees that this is the right way to go. I need to look at the code some, but you are close to having my vote in that regard. 4. I'll grab another image and try again. 5. Very impressive. 6. Let me rephrase my dumb question: is #textEditorNormalFillStyleFor: the right place to try to change the workspace background color? Understood about the fill style - I am just wondering whether that is the right place to set it for the workspaces and code panes in browsers and the debugger. Thanks again!!!! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com 8/29/2007 1:50 PM >>> One by one: 1. Probably best to close all uncecessary windows before installing. 2. Not tested on 3.10 or with OmniBrowser yet. 3. Input still follows mouse cursor, though tabbing works if mouse is still (future enhancement maybe that will change a lot of Morphic code). 4. #modalMorph see point 1. 5. Built on-the fly, just work quickly (I was astonished too). 6. Not sure what you mean about the "ledger" style. For the themes answer any valid fillstyle (Color, GradientFillStyle etc.) Hope this helps... -----Original Message----- From: ui-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:ui-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf Of Bill Schwab Sent: 29 August 2007 7:35 pm To: ui(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org Subject: RE: [UI] Widgets ready Gary, Moniticello seems to have something personal against me (perhaps because I have never taken the time to figure it out). That didn't go well, but loading via the filelist seemed to work fine. I am getting some DNU walkbacks re #topWindow. System windows open prior to the upgrade are often unwilling to close (though the file list did??) and some things such as sender/implementors in the IDE will not open. Zurgle did some similar things IIRC, though I also recall being able to halo things out of existence there, but am not having luck with that here. At least in the basic controls example, I am finding the input focus follows the mouse cursor, and I thought I read that you had addressed that (or is there more I need to load or configure?). For example, after clicking in the text entry field, the focus gets stolen by simply mousing over the disabled text entry or various lists and maybe groups. I _think_ I have the image set to not do that kind of thing, at least not any more than usual. Is the behavior expected, or should I grab a new image? At least closing extant windows starts going bad in #promptForCancel and PSUIManager>>confirm:. In trying to learn about it, I chose Implementors of... in the debugger and got what appears to the same basic problem in #modalMorph. Semi-rhetorical question: how did you get the task bar previews to work so quickly? Are they cached, or do you build them on the fly? I am afraid that I must tear myself away for now. More later. Dumb question: one of the things I have long liked in Dolphin is the ledger color backgrounds in their editors. What would be the best place to make a change that would affect workspaces, code panes of the browsers and debugger, etc.? I found #textEditorNormalFillStyleFor:, but its complexity in the soft theme makes me wonder whether its the right thing - nothing looks like that would be required to render it?? Let's see, it was 20 minutes ago I was saying I needed to stop fiddling :) Thanks!! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui

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RE: [UI] Widgets ready
by Andrew Tween 29 Aug '07

29 Aug '07

Hi Gary, Thanks for sharing this. My first impression was WOW. Then I worked out how to change the Theme and it's WWWOOOWWW. I love the popup preview windows from the task bar. And the shadowed text in the window title & task bar. It's the Dog's B*****ks mate ;) Cheers, Andy > From: gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com> To: ui(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Date: Wed, 29 Aug 2007 14:45:00 +0100> Subject: [UI] Widgets ready> > Well, I think the Widgets/UITheme stuff is ready for a first release :-)> Tested on a stock 3.9 image, not looked at 3.10 yet...> > Consists of two Monticello packages:> The main "Widgets" package including theme support and Morphic> fixes;> An extra ToolBuilder package to integrate the new dialogs into the> environment> (where UIManager is used at any rate, directly or> indirectly).> > Looks nicer with Andy Tween's FreeType packages installed though will work> without.> > Any suggestions as to how people want the packages submitted?> My SqueakMap account sadly points to an older email and I've forgotten the> password...> > If people would like a script for setting preferences I can post here.> > Will repost this on squeak-dev for those not following here!> > Gary.> > _______________________________________________> UI mailing list> UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui _________________________________________________________________ Celeb spotting – Play CelebMashup and win cool prizes https://www.celebmashup.com/index2.html

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RE: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 29 Aug '07

29 Aug '07

Gary, 1. Fair enough. 2. I don't think it's either, but who knows what I grabbed. The image is a working one from my Ubuntu box. 3. This one hurts. With that said, I am willing to work at making it work; it is one of my main hopes for this group. With much respect for what you have done and gratitude for your sharing it, and for releasing it for us to play with it<g>, tabbing is meaningless if a twitch pushes the mouse and snaps the cursor away. As I said, I will gladly help out if the group agrees that this is the right way to go. I need to look at the code some, but you are close to having my vote in that regard. 4. I'll grab another image and try again. 5. Very impressive. 6. Let me rephrase my dumb question: is #textEditorNormalFillStyleFor: the right place to try to change the workspace background color? Understood about the fill style - I am just wondering whether that is the right place to set it for the workspaces and code panes in browsers and the debugger. Thanks again!!!! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com 8/29/2007 1:50 PM >>> One by one: 1. Probably best to close all uncecessary windows before installing. 2. Not tested on 3.10 or with OmniBrowser yet. 3. Input still follows mouse cursor, though tabbing works if mouse is still (future enhancement maybe that will change a lot of Morphic code). 4. #modalMorph see point 1. 5. Built on-the fly, just work quickly (I was astonished too). 6. Not sure what you mean about the "ledger" style. For the themes answer any valid fillstyle (Color, GradientFillStyle etc.) Hope this helps... -----Original Message----- From: ui-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:ui-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf Of Bill Schwab Sent: 29 August 2007 7:35 pm To: ui(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org Subject: RE: [UI] Widgets ready Gary, Moniticello seems to have something personal against me (perhaps because I have never taken the time to figure it out). That didn't go well, but loading via the filelist seemed to work fine. I am getting some DNU walkbacks re #topWindow. System windows open prior to the upgrade are often unwilling to close (though the file list did??) and some things such as sender/implementors in the IDE will not open. Zurgle did some similar things IIRC, though I also recall being able to halo things out of existence there, but am not having luck with that here. At least in the basic controls example, I am finding the input focus follows the mouse cursor, and I thought I read that you had addressed that (or is there more I need to load or configure?). For example, after clicking in the text entry field, the focus gets stolen by simply mousing over the disabled text entry or various lists and maybe groups. I _think_ I have the image set to not do that kind of thing, at least not any more than usual. Is the behavior expected, or should I grab a new image? At least closing extant windows starts going bad in #promptForCancel and PSUIManager>>confirm:. In trying to learn about it, I chose Implementors of... in the debugger and got what appears to the same basic problem in #modalMorph. Semi-rhetorical question: how did you get the task bar previews to work so quickly? Are they cached, or do you build them on the fly? I am afraid that I must tear myself away for now. More later. Dumb question: one of the things I have long liked in Dolphin is the ledger color backgrounds in their editors. What would be the best place to make a change that would affect workspaces, code panes of the browsers and debugger, etc.? I found #textEditorNormalFillStyleFor:, but its complexity in the soft theme makes me wonder whether its the right thing - nothing looks like that would be required to render it?? Let's see, it was 20 minutes ago I was saying I needed to stop fiddling :) Thanks!! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui

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RE: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 29 Aug '07

29 Aug '07

Gary, Moniticello seems to have something personal against me (perhaps because I have never taken the time to figure it out). That didn't go well, but loading via the filelist seemed to work fine. I am getting some DNU walkbacks re #topWindow. System windows open prior to the upgrade are often unwilling to close (though the file list did??) and some things such as sender/implementors in the IDE will not open. Zurgle did some similar things IIRC, though I also recall being able to halo things out of existence there, but am not having luck with that here. At least in the basic controls example, I am finding the input focus follows the mouse cursor, and I thought I read that you had addressed that (or is there more I need to load or configure?). For example, after clicking in the text entry field, the focus gets stolen by simply mousing over the disabled text entry or various lists and maybe groups. I _think_ I have the image set to not do that kind of thing, at least not any more than usual. Is the behavior expected, or should I grab a new image? At least closing extant windows starts going bad in #promptForCancel and PSUIManager>>confirm:. In trying to learn about it, I chose Implementors of... in the debugger and got what appears to the same basic problem in #modalMorph. Semi-rhetorical question: how did you get the task bar previews to work so quickly? Are they cached, or do you build them on the fly? I am afraid that I must tear myself away for now. More later. Dumb question: one of the things I have long liked in Dolphin is the ledger color backgrounds in their editors. What would be the best place to make a change that would affect workspaces, code panes of the browsers and debugger, etc.? I found #textEditorNormalFillStyleFor:, but its complexity in the soft theme makes me wonder whether its the right thing - nothing looks like that would be required to render it?? Let's see, it was 20 minutes ago I was saying I needed to stop fiddling :) Thanks!! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029

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Re: [UI] Widgets ready
by Bill Schwab 29 Aug '07

29 Aug '07

Gary, I would not presume to describe the best way to release it. I will happily grab it from an arbitrary URL if that is of any help to you. Thanks for making it available! Bill Wilhelm K. Schwab, Ph.D. University of Florida Department of Anesthesiology PO Box 100254 Gainesville, FL 32610-0254 Email: bschwab(a)anest.ufl.edu Tel: (352) 846-1285 FAX: (352) 392-7029 >>> gazzaguru2(a)btinternet.com 08/29/07 9:45 AM >>> Well, I think the Widgets/UITheme stuff is ready for a first release :-) Tested on a stock 3.9 image, not looked at 3.10 yet... Consists of two Monticello packages: The main "Widgets" package including theme support and Morphic fixes; An extra ToolBuilder package to integrate the new dialogs into the environment (where UIManager is used at any rate, directly or indirectly). Looks nicer with Andy Tween's FreeType packages installed though will work without. Any suggestions as to how people want the packages submitted? My SqueakMap account sadly points to an older email and I've forgotten the password... If people would like a script for setting preferences I can post here. Will repost this on squeak-dev for those not following here! Gary. _______________________________________________ UI mailing list UI(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ui

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UI August 2007