Takashi,
do we want to add Etoys to pootle?
- Bert -
Begin forwarded message:
From: Sayamindu Dasgupta sayamindu@gmail.com Date: November 19, 2007 19:00:12 GMT+01:00 To: localization@lists.laptop.org Subject: [Localization] [Announce] Pootle now fully open for translation
Hi all,
We are extremely happy to announce that the new translation infrastructure at dev.laptop.org is now fully open for translation. The URL of the on line translation and translation project management software is http://dev.laptop.org/translate. Administrative privileges have been granted to the following users for the following languages:
Username Languages ======== =========== khaled -- Arabic YuanChao -- Chinese (Traditional) simosx -- Greek carlo -- Italian shankar -- Nepali huda -- Urdu
So if you want to translate for any of the above languages - you know whom to contact :-).
(admins: please note that there are project wide administrative rights as well as language specific admin rights. There is also a slightly cluttered document for you at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/Administration)
If you want to start a new team for your language, file a ticket at http://dev.laptop.org under the category localisation (mention your Pootle username and the language code you want to handle), and we'll take care of assigning the relevant rights.
There's a FAQ on the setup that we have at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/FAQ
Some things to keep in mind while translating (aka, Known Issues):
- The Commit and Update buttons (if you see them at all) will not
work until we make any further announcements. So please do not use them :-) 2. This is the first time we are opening up XO Core and XO Bundled for translations. If you see anything odd - file a ticket (or even better, ping us on #olpc-pootle on irc.freenode.net)
As a conclusion to this mail - we would like to thank everyone who has been (directly or indirectly) involved in the process. It has been a long battle with Pootle/Git/and whatnot - but in the end we have what is, what we hope to be a much smoother and easier to manager translation workflow for all software designed for the XO
Thank you again, Warm regards and happy translating :-). Sayamindu (On behalf of the entire team working on the Pootle installation)
PS: As a personal 'PS', I would like to specially thank Xavi and Rafael for working really hard on this - without them, this would not have been possible
-- Sayamindu Dasgupta http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings
Localization mailing list Localization@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/localization
Here is my thought though I am not Takashi :)
We have had limited experience with LaunchPad. I felt that we don't have enough control over the project in the site and it takes too long to make project go forward. Admin folks of LaunchPad (not EToys folks) do review and authorize when updated PO is uploaded. It actually took a few days for all of POs to be released, though our experience was only once. I believe they are trying to do their best, but I felt too slow.
our PO has thousands of words, it might be overwhelming to reviewers, that will be still risk if we go OLPC's instance of pootle, I think.
I would like to know how things is going on the pootle. But accessing http://dev.laptop.org/translate results error right now... is it stable now or wrong URL?
/Korakurider
--- Bert Freudenberg bert@freudenbergs.de wrote:
Takashi,
do we want to add Etoys to pootle?
- Bert -
Begin forwarded message:
From: Sayamindu Dasgupta sayamindu@gmail.com Date: November 19, 2007 19:00:12 GMT+01:00 To: localization@lists.laptop.org Subject: [Localization] [Announce] Pootle now
fully open for
translation
Hi all,
We are extremely happy to announce that the new
translation
infrastructure at dev.laptop.org is now fully open
for translation.
The URL of the on line translation and translation
project management
software is http://dev.laptop.org/translate. Administrative privileges have been granted to the
following users for
the following languages:
Username Languages ======== =========== khaled -- Arabic YuanChao -- Chinese (Traditional) simosx -- Greek carlo -- Italian shankar -- Nepali huda -- Urdu
So if you want to translate for any of the above
languages - you know
whom to contact :-).
(admins: please note that there are project wide
administrative rights
as well as language specific admin rights. There
is also a slightly
cluttered document for you at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/Administration)
If you want to start a new team for your language,
file a ticket at
http://dev.laptop.org under the category
localisation (mention your
Pootle username and the language code you want to
handle), and we'll
take care of assigning the relevant rights.
There's a FAQ on the setup that we have at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/FAQ
Some things to keep in mind while translating
(aka, Known Issues):
- The Commit and Update buttons (if you see them
at all) will not
work until we make any further announcements. So please
do not use them :-)
- This is the first time we are opening up XO
Core and XO Bundled for
translations. If you see anything odd - file a
ticket (or even better,
ping us on #olpc-pootle on irc.freenode.net)
As a conclusion to this mail - we would like to
thank everyone who has
been (directly or indirectly) involved in the
process. It has been a
long battle with Pootle/Git/and whatnot - but in
the end we have what
is, what we hope to be a much smoother and easier
to manager
translation workflow for all software designed for the XO
Thank you again, Warm regards and happy translating :-). Sayamindu (On behalf of the entire team working on the
Pootle installation)
PS: As a personal 'PS', I would like to specially
thank Xavi and
Rafael for working really hard on this - without them,
this would not have
been possible
-- Sayamindu Dasgupta http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings
Localization mailing list Localization@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/localization
Etoys mailing list Etoys@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/etoys
-------------------------------------- New Design Yahoo! JAPAN 2008/01/01 http://pr.mail.yahoo.co.jp/newdesign/
Hi korakurider
I would like to know how things is going on the pootle. But accessing http://dev.laptop.org/translate results error right now... is it stable now or wrong URL?
thats the stable URL and it works for me :).
Thanks Rafael, I can access the site now.
/korakurider
--- Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero dirakx@gmail.com wrote:
Hi korakurider
I would like to know how things is going on the
pootle.
But accessing http://dev.laptop.org/translate
results
error right now... is it stable now or wrong URL?
thats the stable URL and it works for me :).
-- Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero One Laptop Per Child rafael@laptop.org
-------------------------------------- New Design Yahoo! JAPAN 2008/01/01 http://pr.mail.yahoo.co.jp/newdesign/
Hi,
It looks appealing. At least, it has a search field. Let's evaluate more whether Pootle is good enough.
Cheers, - Takashi
korakurider wrote:
Thanks Rafael, I can access the site now.
/korakurider
--- Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero dirakx@gmail.com wrote:
Hi korakurider
I would like to know how things is going on the
pootle.
But accessing http://dev.laptop.org/translate
results
error right now... is it stable now or wrong URL?
thats the stable URL and it works for me :).
At least OLPC contributors are genuinely interested in translating all activities. By not being visible at pootle, we're missing out on these volunteers. And launchpad has not exactly attracted many translators to date.
- Bert -
On Nov 20, 2007, at 11:11 , Takashi Yamamiya wrote:
Hi,
It looks appealing. At least, it has a search field. Let's evaluate more whether Pootle is good enough.
Cheers,
- Takashi
korakurider wrote:
Thanks Rafael, I can access the site now.
/korakurider
--- Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero dirakx@gmail.com wrote:
Hi korakurider
I would like to know how things is going on the
pootle.
But accessing http://dev.laptop.org/translate
results
error right now... is it stable now or wrong URL?
thats the stable URL and it works for me :).
Etoys mailing list Etoys@lists.laptop.org http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/etoys
Bert Freudenberg bert@freudenbergs.de wrote:
At least OLPC contributors are genuinely interested in translating all activities. By not being visible at pootle, we're missing out on these volunteers. And launchpad has not exactly attracted many translators to date.
Pootle itself seems quite appealing also to me.
My thought about using Pootle is:
+ We need to manage translations for language that isn't current target of OLPC (i.e. Japanese). While they made clear that all, languages will be welcomed, it is also clear they are focusing toward the targetted languages, and right now there isn't actually any translation project for the language on the pootle instance. So some negotiation / walk through / testing will be needed to use the langauges in the site.
+ It seems that OLPC pootle is tightly integrated with git: By commit in pootle, updated PO will be directly committed into git. (other version control system including SVN can be integrated with pootle) EToys project is using its own SVN for managing POs and very limited folks have write access to the repository. Do you really want to allow direct access to SVN to folks of translation project? I think we need to have separated baseline and manual merge process controlled by etoys developer who is doing actual build.
Etoys could have its own pootle instance if you want complete control...
/Korakurider -------------------------------------- New Design Yahoo! JAPAN 2008/01/01 http://pr.mail.yahoo.co.jp/newdesign/
On Nov 20, 2007, at 18:03 , korakurider@yahoo.co.jp wrote:
Bert Freudenberg bert@freudenbergs.de wrote:
At least OLPC contributors are genuinely interested in translating all activities. By not being visible at pootle, we're missing out on these volunteers. And launchpad has not exactly attracted many translators to date.
Pootle itself seems quite appealing also to me.
My thought about using Pootle is:
- We need to manage translations for language that isn't current target of OLPC (i.e. Japanese). While they made clear that all, languages will be welcomed, it is also clear they are focusing
toward the targetted languages, and right now there isn't actually any translation project for the language on the pootle instance. So some negotiation / walk through / testing will be needed to use the langauges in the site.
I guess adding another language would actually be welcomed by OLPC.
- It seems that OLPC pootle is tightly integrated with git: By commit in pootle, updated PO will be directly committed into git.
We can easily move POs from svn to git.
(other version control system including SVN can be integrated with pootle) EToys project is using its own SVN for managing POs and very limited folks have write access to the repository. Do you really want to allow direct access to SVN to folks of translation project? I think we need to have separated baseline and manual merge process controlled by etoys developer who is doing actual build.
If you think so, we can have the "proposed" POs in git and the "released" ones in SVN. I for one wouldn't mind having contributors check in their stuff directly.
Etoys could have its own pootle instance if you want complete control...
Nah, that would be overkill, and defeat the purpose of getting OLPC volunteers to contribute Etoys translations.
- Bert -
This is a sort of catch-all response to the thread (so I'll be addressing issues from several mails)
== Size of Etoys == Yes, by current XO standards Etoys is huge (although TamTam is playing catch-up ;) so it could merit a project all by itself. A bit redundant (1 project : 1 POT) but it would also a better permission control & some security.
== Pootle functionality vs Launchpad == A nice feature of Pootle is a series of checks that can be performed on the POs (arguments, capitalization, punctuation, etc. quite a lot, but my guess is that they are geared towards european languages and grammar - helpful nevertheless). I don't know if Launchpad has similar features.
On the other hand, Launchpad has the ability to reuse translations from other projects/packages/files... something that if we manage to work out in Pootle will be a manual & batch process... Lacking that, the glossary/terminology in Pootle is quite handy and not too complicated to work out.
== Pootle languages == Extremely simple to add & setup. You define a language, declare the number of plurals, the plural formula and you're set to associate it with the projects. The hard part is getting the admin & specific workflow ;)
== Version control systems == The integration with GIT was the blocker because it was backported from Pootle's bleeding edge and our own personal difficulties. Other version control systems (like SVN, CVS were built-in, but the focus was GIT). We are planning to open an "XO-Extras" project intended to target non git-d.l.o projects...
== In summary ==
Etoys may be a bit too big for initial testing and working out other version control systems, but I see no problem in pulling it in once we know how (iow, a smaller guinea pig may be preferable) The trick would be not to disrupt the L10n process currently working for Etoys...
The optimal configuration would be for Etoys to benefit from both Launchpad & Pootle. But I have no idea how feasible that is.
A relatively simple test could be to set up a mock project without version control and upload the POT & POs of Etoys so that you can get a better feeling... if merging POs manually into Launchpad is not an issue you could sync with them at will, or sync from Launchpad into Pootle (although there are some issues to explore there).
BTW, these are just my ideas :)
Cheers, Xavier
On Monday 19 November 2007 17:28, Bert Freudenberg wrote: BF> Takashi, BF> BF> do we want to add Etoys to pootle? BF> BF> - Bert - BF> BF> BF> Begin forwarded message: BF> BF> > From: Sayamindu Dasgupta sayamindu@gmail.com BF> > Date: November 19, 2007 19:00:12 GMT+01:00 BF> > To: localization@lists.laptop.org BF> > Subject: [Localization] [Announce] Pootle now fully open BF> > for translation BF> > BF> > Hi all, BF> > BF> > We are extremely happy to announce that the new translation BF> > infrastructure at dev.laptop.org is now fully open for BF> > translation. BF> > The URL of the on line translation and translation project BF> > management software is http://dev.laptop.org/translate. BF> > Administrative privileges have been granted to the BF> > following users for the following languages: BF> > BF> > Username Languages BF> > ======== =========== BF> > khaled -- Arabic BF> > YuanChao -- Chinese (Traditional) BF> > simosx -- Greek BF> > carlo -- Italian BF> > shankar -- Nepali BF> > huda -- Urdu BF> > BF> > So if you want to translate for any of the above languages BF> > - you know whom to contact :-). BF> > BF> > (admins: please note that there are project wide BF> > administrative rights as well as language specific admin BF> > rights. There is also a slightly cluttered document for BF> > you at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/Administration) BF> > BF> > If you want to start a new team for your language, file a BF> > ticket at http://dev.laptop.org under the category BF> > localisation (mention your Pootle username and the BF> > language code you want to handle), and we'll take care of BF> > assigning the relevant rights. BF> > BF> > There's a FAQ on the setup that we have at BF> > http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/FAQ BF> > BF> > Some things to keep in mind while translating (aka, Known BF> > Issues): BF> > 1. The Commit and Update buttons (if you see them at all) BF> > will not work until we make any further announcements. So BF> > please do not use them :-) BF> > 2. This is the first time we are opening up XO Core and XO BF> > Bundled for translations. If you see anything odd - file a BF> > ticket (or even better, ping us on #olpc-pootle on BF> > irc.freenode.net) BF> > BF> > As a conclusion to this mail - we would like to thank BF> > everyone who has been (directly or indirectly) involved in BF> > the process. It has been a long battle with Pootle/Git/and BF> > whatnot - but in the end we have what is, what we hope to BF> > be a much smoother and easier to manager translation BF> > workflow for all software designed for the XO BF> > BF> > BF> > Thank you again, BF> > Warm regards and happy translating :-). BF> > Sayamindu BF> > (On behalf of the entire team working on the Pootle BF> > installation) BF> > BF> > PS: As a personal 'PS', I would like to specially thank BF> > Xavi and Rafael for working really hard on this - without BF> > them, this would not have been possible BF> > BF> > -- BF> > Sayamindu Dasgupta BF> > http://sayamindu.randomink.org/ramblings BF> > BF> > _______________________________________________ BF> > Localization mailing list BF> > Localization@lists.laptop.org BF> > http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/localization BF> BF> _______________________________________________ BF> Etoys mailing list BF> Etoys@lists.laptop.org BF> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/etoys BF>
Hi,
Xavier Alvarez wrote:
A relatively simple test could be to set up a mock project without version control and upload the POT & POs of Etoys so that you can get a better feeling...
korakurider wrote:
Actually I would like to volunteer to participate the testing, especially for functional walk through for language addition to the pootle instance (i.e. Japaneses).
I didn't quite follow the entire discussion though, according to http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/FAQ#Administrative is it enough to send a ticket to tell them a URL of http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/ to register EToys? Are there any other way to register a project for "a mock project"?
Cheers, - Takashi
Takashi,
For testing purposes, I can set up an Etoys project. I just need to procure the POT & PO files, upload them and you can test...
Note that it won't be integrated with any version control system, so any changes (translations) you may want to keep you will need to merge them manually.
Cheers, Xavier
On Wednesday 21 November 2007 03:54, you wrote: TY> Hi, TY> TY> Xavier Alvarez wrote: TY> > A relatively simple test could be to set up a mock project TY> > without version control and upload the POT & POs of Etoys TY> > so that you can get a better feeling... TY> TY> korakurider wrote: TY> > Actually I would like to volunteer to participate the TY> > testing, especially for functional walk through for TY> > language addition to the pootle instance (i.e. Japaneses). TY> TY> I didn't quite follow the entire discussion though, TY> according to http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Pootle/FAQ#Administrative is it TY> enough to send a ticket to tell them a URL of TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/ to register TY> EToys? TY> Are there any other way to register a project for "a TY> mock project"? TY> TY> Cheers, TY> - Takashi
Cheers, Xavier
Hi, Xavier,
Xavier Alvarez wrote:
For testing purposes, I can set up an Etoys project. I just need to procure the POT & PO files, upload them and you can test...
Note that it won't be integrated with any version control system, so any changes (translations) you may want to keep you will need to merge them manually.
Great!
I posted a ticket with the POT & PO files http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/5067.
Thank you,
- Takashi
----------
#5067: New Pootle project request (eToys) --------------------------+------------------------------------------------- Reporter: Takashi | Owner: xavi Type: task | Status: new Priority: normal | Milestone: Never Assigned Component: localization | Version: Keywords: | Verified: 0 --------------------------+------------------------------------------------- EToys team is planning to use Pootle for the translation, but before that, we want to test it. Could you import these POT and PO files into Pootle without version control?
http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/etoys.pot http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/de.po http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/es.po http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/en.po http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/fr.po http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/ja.po http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/pt.po
Takashi,
A TEST Pootle Etoys project has been created and loaded...
Things to note: 1) suggestion / review is disabled 2) both anonymous and registered users can translate 3) no version control
Reasons: 1) Pootle for historical reasons handles suggestions based on the *comment* line (not the msgid). So if you have the same comment in more than one msgid, the suggestions get all mixed up. Some say feature, I say bug...
2) Given the test nature of the project, no point in forcing people to register.
3) SVN may be in our plans and probably easy to do, but for the moment I don't want to risk swimming in those waters ;)
Testing URL: https://dev.laptop.org/translate/projects/etoys/
Please keep us posted.
Cheers, Xavier
On Wednesday 21 November 2007 14:06, Takashi Yamamiya wrote: TY> Hi, Xavier, TY> TY> Xavier Alvarez wrote: TY> > For testing purposes, I can set up an Etoys project. I just TY> > need to procure the POT & PO files, upload them and you TY> > can test... TY> > TY> > Note that it won't be integrated with any version control TY> > system, so any changes (translations) you may want to keep TY> > you will need to merge them manually. TY> TY> Great! TY> TY> I posted a ticket with the POT & PO files TY> http://dev.laptop.org/ticket/5067. TY> TY> Thank you, TY> TY> - Takashi TY> TY> ---------- TY> TY> #5067: New Pootle project request (eToys) TY> --------------------------+------------------------------------- ------------ TY> Reporter: Takashi | Owner: xavi TY> Type: task | Status: new TY> Priority: normal | Milestone: Never Assigned TY> Component: localization | Version: TY> Keywords: | Verified: 0 TY> --------------------------+------------------------------------- ------------ TY> EToys team is planning to use Pootle for the translation, but before that, TY> we want to test it. Could you import these POT and PO files into Pootle TY> without version control? TY> TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/etoys.pot TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/de.po TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/es.po TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/en.po TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/fr.po TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/ja.po TY> http://etoys.laptop.org/svn/trunk/etoys/po/etoys/pt.po TY> TY>
On Nov 21, 2007, at 18:40 , Xavier Alvarez wrote:
Takashi,
A TEST Pootle Etoys project has been created and loaded...
Things to note:
- suggestion / review is disabled
- both anonymous and registered users can translate
- no version control
Reasons:
- Pootle for historical reasons handles suggestions based on the
*comment* line (not the msgid). So if you have the same comment in more than one msgid, the suggestions get all mixed up. Some say feature, I say bug...
- Given the test nature of the project, no point in forcing
people to register.
- SVN may be in our plans and probably easy to do, but for the
moment I don't want to risk swimming in those waters ;)
We could easily switch to git - we use both, and po's happen to be in the part managed by svn.
Testing URL: https://dev.laptop.org/translate/projects/etoys/
Hmm, 22K phrases does not sound right ...
- Bert -
Bert Freudenberg wrote:
On Nov 21, 2007, at 18:40 , Xavier Alvarez wrote:
Takashi,
A TEST Pootle Etoys project has been created and loaded...
Thank you!
We could easily switch to git - we use both, and po's happen to be in the part managed by svn.
Yes, we could move POs. But I prefer keeping them on svn if possible. Because the POT is synchronized by the etoys.image, so it is handy if we can refer them by same revision number.
Testing URL: https://dev.laptop.org/translate/projects/etoys/
Hmm, 22K phrases does not sound right ...
This is interesting mystery.
Cheers, - Takashi
On Nov 21, 2007, at 19:50 , Takashi Yamamiya wrote:
Bert Freudenberg wrote:
On Nov 21, 2007, at 18:40 , Xavier Alvarez wrote:
Takashi,
A TEST Pootle Etoys project has been created and loaded...
Thank you!
We could easily switch to git - we use both, and po's happen to be in the part managed by svn.
Yes, we could move POs. But I prefer keeping them on svn if possible. Because the POT is synchronized by the etoys.image, so it is handy if we can refer them by same revision number.
Testing URL: https://dev.laptop.org/translate/projects/etoys/
Hmm, 22K phrases does not sound right ...
This is interesting mystery.
Xavi replied on the localization list:
Begin forwarded message:
From: Xavier Alvarez xavi.alvarez@gmail.com Date: November 21, 2007 19:47:48 GMT+01:00 To: localization@lists.laptop.org Subject: Re: [Localization] [Etoys] Fwd: Pootle now fully open for translation
BF> > Testing URL: https://dev.laptop.org/translate/projects/etoys/ BF> BF> Hmm, 22K phrases does not sound right ...
Jeje, that's a 'standard' confusion... Pootle does most of its reporting based on 'words' instead of 'strings' given that it's a more reasonable unit for estimating translator workload...
xavi@translate:~/etoys$ pocount etoys.pot etoys.pot type strings words (source) words (translation) trans.: 0 ( 0%) 0 ( 0%) 0 fuzzy: 0 ( 0%) 0 ( 0%) n/a untrans.: 3707 (100%) 22948 (100%) n/a Total: 3707 22948 0
The PO files have the following counts:
de.po, 1866, 10170, 7786, 0, 0, 1794, 12586, 3660, 22756 en.po, 9, 16, 16, 0, 0, 3651, 22740, 3660, 22756 es.po, 2431, 11794, 13405, 0, 0, 1229, 10962, 3660, 22756 fr.po, 2617, 12983, 14243, 0, 0, 1043, 9773, 3660, 22756 ja.po, 2155, 10254, 2397, 0, 0, 1505, 12502, 3660, 22756 pt.po, 2397, 11762, 12743, 0, 0, 1263, 10994, 3660, 22756
Columns: Filename, Translated Messages, Translated Source Words, Translated Target Words, Fuzzy Messages, Fuzzy Source Words, Untranslated Messages, Untranslated Source Words, Total Message, Total Source Words, Review Messages, Review Source Words
- Bert -
etoys-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
Bert Freudenberg -
korakurider -
korakuriderļ¼ yahoo.co.jp
-
Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero -
Takashi Yamamiya -
Xavier Alvarez