I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak.
_______________________________________________ No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com
Jeff wrote:
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment.
For what it's worth: I wish I could help you.
At the moment, I'm pretty puzzled/stumped by Squeak myself. I started getting into this in an attempt to wrap my head around Croquet by wrapping my head around Squeak. At the moment I've had to go back and start over by wrapping my head around Smalltalk. (Which isn't even talking about real life stuff; trying to learn Smalltalk while working with PHP and Perl during the day is a great way to forget everything you've learned the night before.)
I've just about got objects down, and hopefully will get to the Wonderland stuff this weekend. If I find anything useful regarding keyboard controls, I'll be sure to post! (Though, I get the feeling you're likely to figure it out before I even start on Wonderland.)
Good luck.
On 8 nov. 06, at 07:10, Andrew Burton wrote:
Jeff wrote:
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment.
For what it's worth: I wish I could help you.
At the moment, I'm pretty puzzled/stumped by Squeak myself. I started getting into this in an attempt to wrap my head around Croquet by wrapping my head around Squeak. At the moment I've had to go back and start over by wrapping my head around Smalltalk. (Which isn't even talking about real life stuff; trying to learn Smalltalk while working with PHP and Perl during the day is a great way to forget everything you've learned the night before.)
may be the best is to try seaside in that case :)
I've just about got objects down, and hopefully will get to the Wonderland stuff this weekend. If I find anything useful regarding keyboard controls, I'll be sure to post! (Though, I get the feeling you're likely to figure it out before I even start on Wonderland.)
Good luck.
-- Andrew Burton tuglyraisin@aol.com http://utilitarian.us - A Guide to Esoteric Technology in Paragon City http://jarodrussell.livejournal.com/ - Take a guess. ;) _______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Hi jeff
Not everybody read this mailing-list. So post also in squeak-dev your question. And people are also busy. BTW: you should have repeated your question
Stef
PS: I read nearly 120 mails per day and I have to reply to 25% at least.
On 8 nov. 06, at 06:28, Jeff wrote:
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak.
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com _______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
I've not been reading this list religiously, I've been dealing with personal issues and poring over certification requirements for FIPS 140-2 and Common Criteria.
Honestly, I don't know how to solve the issue. I haven't looked at Wonderland.
-Kyle H ----- Original Message ----- From: Jeff To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org Sent: Tuesday, November 07, 2006 10:28 PM Subject: [Newbies] Disappointed
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak.
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------
_______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Hi Jeff,
sorry, in the enthusiasm over having found out something, I totally forgot that you were asking about reactions to key strokes, not mouse clicks :-)
Let me give you my 2 cents about your frustrations. Again, I'm just trying to help, so please don't take it personally.
- Ask early. I would not have spent 5 days trying (and failing) to solve a particular problem, that only builds frustration. Couldn't you have asked a bit earlier? A good rule of thumb is, I think, to start asking when you're not making significant progress anymore.
- Don't get stuck. Can you structure your work / play so that you can have more patience waiting for an answer? Maybe you can ask a question and get something else done in the mean time? That way you make progress even while you're stuck on that issue
- Ask in small chunks. I have read somewhere that on mailing lists the answers are generated by people for whom it was _not much work_ to find the solution. It's like you ask 200 people the same question, 20 would know the answer with some effort, but 2 know it right away and only have to write it down, takes them a few seconds to minutes. Those are the two from whom you get an answer. So make it easy for your question to stick out in the flow of emails and catch the attention of those 2 people. In more concrete terms, instead of one email with 8 questions, post 8 emails with one question each. Make a meaningful subject line. Don't mix general commentary with concrete questions.
- Ask the right people. When you don't get an answer on the beginners mailing list, try squeak-dev. I think only a fraction of the experts on squeak-dev are also subscribed to the beginners mailing list. There is a lot of traffic on squeak-dev, so it's even more important to make your questions easy to find and easy to answer.
- Ask on irc. There is an irc channel where you can chat with other squeakers in real time: http://people.squeakfoundation.org/article/7.html
I hope that you'll have better experiences with the squeak community. BTW, what are you trying to create? Maybe you can give a short description in a separate email?
best regards
Matthias
On 11/8/06, Jeff hombreviii@myway.com wrote:
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak.
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com
Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
Hi Jeff,
Welcome to the beginners list!
I appreciate the fact that you are sticking with the problem. That in my opinion is the best way to learn. I didn't answer your question because I do not feel that I am an expert in Wonderland. If the question was something like how can I map a key to so some action that is pretty easy, IF that action is an isolated easily called method. Something like: Utilities garbageCollectAndReport. This is a class method and there is no instance that needs to be sent to.
If a key stroke needs to be captured and affect a running instance it is a bit more difficult to do but still very possible. The issue here is that there is a complicated event loop that needs to be tapped into but this would be very difficult to explain to someone with limited experience. The fact that you are using wonderland means that there is probably already a hook to do what you want so a complicated explanation of what I know will probably only confuse the matter and make things more difficult for you.
There are people on this list that have much more experience with Wonderland, but nobody that will answer your question within hours.
I would love to have Squeak be much more a pleasant experience for you. My suggestion is that you start slower and work on understanding basic concepts of Squeak. Do more tutorials; look into how some things work before trying to extend them.
Also a comment, starting with the assumption that people are not going to help you is discouraging to people who might. People are more likely to help people that work hard themselves and will benefit from the help and will appreciate that help. I think you have the work hard part down. You need to be a bit more appreciative of the effort and time that goes into helping you.
Now to your question: Matthias was right and he sent you to exactly the place you needed to go. I just loaded a 3.8 image and did the helicopter tutorial. I have to say it was great fun! Wonderland is a very nice piece of code and I can see that it would be fun to play with. The tutorial is fun but the concepts are not easy and how the authors did what they did is very clever but also difficult especially when you venture off the beaten path. You picked a hard place to start! That by itself can be very frustrating.
Here is your answer but the answer is not perfect. What I noticed is that the keys only have focus when the actor is under the mouse. There may be a way to make this work in the context of a world but I couldn't get it to work that way. The world does not appear to have a reactions collection, but there does seem to be a little hook in Scene that might have been intended to work that way. Again this is an advanced concept. I also tried adding a reaction to the ground to make it easier for this to work. The ground accepted the reaction but did not act on it. I added a reaction of [:event | self halt] but that did nothing so maybe background items like ground and sky don't quite work or don't respond to certain reactions the way other actors do. It makes sense that Wonderland might be written this way. If you added a right key press to multiple objects how is it supposed to know which item the key press should control. There could be a number of ways to fix this like adding an actor that is a control stick or something, then placing the mouse over the control stick would work the helicopter. (just a suggestion of where you might go from here)
Ok so here is the code:
helicopter addResponse: [:event |
event getMorphicEvent keyString = '<left>'
ifTrue: [helicopter move: #left].
event getMorphicEvent keyString = '<right>'
ifTrue: [helicopter move: #right].
] to: #keyPress
I hope that helps, welcome to the list and
Happy coding,
Ron Teitelbaum
President / Principal Software Engineer
US Medical Record Specialists
Ron@USMedRec.com
_____
From: beginners-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org [mailto:beginners-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Sent: Wednesday, November 08, 2006 12:28 AM To: beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org Subject: [Newbies] Disappointed
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak. http://imgfarm.com/images/webmail/rt/img/img1017a1.gif
This isn't really a newbies kind of question - jumped right into the deep end I'd say.
FWIW, probably not many people know the answer. I myself know next to nothing about Wonderlands. I will tell you that you can find most of the event delivery code in HandMorph. So there's someplace to look.
Sorry I can't tell you more.
-Todd Blanchard
On Nov 7, 2006, at 9:28 PM, Jeff wrote:
I'm pretty disappointed with this list at the moment. My last post, "beginners questions" talked about how beginners often don't get their questions answered and pointed out that often when the experts see that an answer, ANY answer, was given they then assume the question was answered, so they don't offer anything more. Now I do appreciate Matthias's honest attempt to answer the question, so I don't want this to be misconstrued as an attack on him. But he obviously misread it. And, well, once people saw that the question of how to make a wonderland actor move in response to mouse clicks had been answered, I didn't get any more help. The question I asked was how to move a wonderland actor with the arrow keys, and I need to do that without the actor having the focus. Unfortunately, since it's been taking so many hours for the messages I've tried to send to get posted on here, (I think I had screwed up joining the list somehow, and redid it so hopefully that problem is solved), it took me a full day to get my question asked and now another full day to explain that the answer I got was to a different question. By the by, I've been spending about 10 hours a day for 5 days now trying to solve this problem. It's getting quite frustrating for me and making me want to give up on squeak.
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding. Make My Way your home on the Web - http://www.myway.com _______________________________________________ Beginners mailing list Beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/beginners
beginners@lists.squeakfoundation.org
-
Andrew Burton -
Jeff -
Kyle Hamilton -
Matthias Berth -
Ron Teitelbaum -
stephane ducasse -
Todd Blanchard