etoys-dev September 2009

etoys-dev@lists.squeakfoundation.org

30 participants
68 discussions

project info tweaks
by Timothy Falconer 10 Sep '09

10 Sep '09

Scott et al, Having used the system a while, I'm thinking the project info box is too glaring, primarily because of the "optional .. click to choose" lines that draw too much attention. Small proposed tweaks: 1. change the label to simply "(none)" ... which has cat = 0 2. move "tags" above the drop downs to make it appear with the other text fields By seeing, "(none)", the optional-nature of the categories is conveyed . . . and the click to choose part should be self-evident once someone tries to change it. It'll also make it look nicer. Take care, Tim -- Timothy Falconer Waveplace Foundation http://waveplace.com 610-797-3100

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Consolidating releases
by Bert Freudenberg 10 Sep '09

10 Sep '09

I noticed yesterday that Yoshiki updated the FishAndPlankton example project a year ago in the Sugar release, but that was still not in the Squeakland repository. Same for the Guides and translations, which were not updated for quite some time. Conversely, the launcher/ tutorials/demo projects were only updated in the Squeakland repository. I (manually) synced the two repositories on Sunday but we need to find a way to only have one repo, really. I think the Sugar release and Squeakland release are virtually indistinguishable now, right? Off the top of my head the only difference is the swapControlAndAltKeys preference, which is enabled for Sugar but not for Squeakland. But we really should set this to the platform default anyway: http://tracker.squeakland.org/browse/SQ-304 Other than for that, do we still need two different release images? Or can we simply share the whole image folder now? - Bert -

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showcase snags
by Timothy Falconer 09 Sep '09

09 Sep '09

Yoshiki et al, Some snags we've found while trying out the login/upload functionality from the dev image . . . 1) when you click on "My Showcase", then login, you have to click "My Showcase" again for the files to show up 2) when you log in with a username that has capital letters, it silently fails (seems to be logged in, but doesn't work) . . . simple solution here is to turn showcase usernames to all lowercase (that's how they're stored). FYI, the website sign-in is case-insensitve, so case is never a problem there . . . I don't know why WebDAV isn't, particularly since it's using the same database lookup. (Even Basic Auth on the website is case-insensitive, which is what WebDAV use, so I'm baffled.) 3) As a more general variant of #2 . . . bad logins of all kinds don't return an error . . . nevermind the case insensitive thing, i type a bogus username or password after clicking "My Showcase" and it seems to work. When I click on "My Showcase" again, it shows "Login Failed." If I click again, it lets my type again. We should have the failed box show directly after login attempt. 4) Assuming #3 is fixed, I'm concerned that users would have to know to click "My Squeakland" again to try another login, particularly since "My Squeakland" is selected. Would be much nicer to show "Login failed, try again" type thing, though I'd settle for having the selection cleared, so the user would at least have a visual cue that the directory isn't selected.

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weekly etoys-dev chat time, take two
by Timothy Falconer 09 Sep '09

09 Sep '09

Hi everyone, I hate to do this, but let's add our times once again. I neglected to add "if-need-be" to the last, and there ended up not being any real common time for key people. http://www.doodle.com/upuqrs6bkpn3padv This one has timezone support too. Take care, Tim

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Re: weekly etoys-dev chat time, take two
by Timothy Falconer 09 Sep '09

09 Sep '09

On Sep 8, 2009, at 10:48 PM, Timothy Falconer wrote: > The best collective time is Tuesday at 2pm ET, which is a time that > everyone can make. I believe this is the current education team > meeting time, though . . . Rita? Wait .. .I meant Thursday at 2pm ET. Sorry :)

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logging into showcase from etoys
by Timothy Falconer 08 Sep '09

08 Sep '09

Yoshiki, et al, The current holdup is that I'm trying to get two different types of authentication to co-exist on the website .... form-based (login page) and HTTP basic (username/password). The rest of the website uses the former and the WebDAV stuff in Etoys uses the latter. I'm trying a few different things to get them to co- exist in the same host, later I'll create a new host just for the WebDAV. The key to understand what I'm doing here is that I want WebDAV to use the same account information as the rest of the website, so you can signup on the website and use your username/password within Etoys. You can try testing now . . . I've turned authentication to basic for now on the main website, which will only affect admin users for now (a dialog box appears instead of the login page). A few points about the way it currently works within Etoys. 1. I'd much prefer a login box with both username and password than a separate prompt for username and password. 2. I'd skip the second username box for "Squeakland Showcase" . . . just assume "etoys" unless someone has already logged in by clicking "My Squeakland". 3. There's no indication of a failed login, it simply shows a blank list ... (try typing random stuff after clicking "My Squeakland" ... also try your website username and password) 4. there's no way to try your login again (as if you type your password wrong) . . . it just uses the old wrong password ... you have to quit Etoys and try again 5. I keep having to give my account name as I drill down into the directory hierachy in "Squeakland Showcase" 6. If I start by clicking "Squeakland Showcase", I have to give my username three times before I get to my password 7. The personal directory isn't created if not found ... I'd rather only create them when the user uploads something for the first time (otherwise we'll have more dirs than we need). I can do this with a servlet, but it would be nice to use WebDAV instead, if possible. 8. (optional, SQ-325) A button called "login" in the keep and load box, probably in the bottom left. This would let users explicitly login (replace it with their username once logged in) 9. (optional, SQ-326) A button on the login box that said "Signup" (it's free!), which led to a dialog box that had: Username Password Password Again First Name Last Name Email Tell us about yourself (with text box) See the issue for Java code that handles the signup . . . should be clear how it's done so you can translate to Squeak. Anyway, I have to remedy the dual-authentication problem soon. Take care, Tim -- Timothy Falconer Immuexa Corporation http://immuexa.com 610-797-3100

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Re: [squeakland] account signup fields
by Timothy Falconer 08 Sep '09

08 Sep '09

Looks like we need a link from within the Etoys signup box to the privacy policy on the website. Someone should also think long and hard about this: http://www.coppa.org/comply.htm "The notice to parents must contain the same information included on the notice on the Web site. In addition, an operator must notify a parent that it wishes to collect personal information from the child; that the parent's consent is required for the collection, use and disclosure of the information; and how the parent can provide consent." "Before collecting, using or disclosing personal information from a child, an operator must obtain verifiable parental consent from the child's parent. This means an operator must make reasonable efforts (taking into consideration available technology) to ensure that before personal information is collected from a child, a parent of the child receives notice of the operator's information practices and consents to those practices." We're not planning on disclosing any of this information, but it seems to be saying here that we need proof of a parent's permission before the email address is collected. Scratch requires: birth date, email, gender, and country, with optional state/prov, and city. If you put in a birth date that's less than 13 years old, it switches the label from "email" to "email address of parent or guardian". http://scratch.mit.edu/signup Scratch's privacy policy is explicit: ---- When you register for an account on the website, we ask for some information. The only required information is your username, password, gender, country and your month and year of birth. We also ask for your city and state or province, but this information is optional. We do not ask for your name, phone number, or home address. If you are 13 or over, we ask for your email address so that we can tell you when there are important changes or new features in Scratch. However, you do not have to give us your email address to use either Scratch or the Scratch website. If you are under 13, we do not collect your email address. We do not make any of your profile information public on the website, except your username and country. ---- It doesn't come right out and say it, but email address (yours or your parents) *IS* required, if you want to post projects to the scratch website. (They actually seem to contradict this.) On Sep 8, 2009, at 10:06 AM, Timothy Falconer wrote: > My personal opinion on all this: > > Within Etoys: > > * username > * password (twice) > * email address > * send me Squeakland's quarterly newsletter > * send me weekly showcase highlights > > (general announcements = either newsletter or showcase box checked) > > > On the web signup page: > > (all of the above) > > * tell us about yourself > * first name > * last name > * country > * want friends see friends > * public first/last name > * public friend list > > > The only one I'm not sure about is "country", which might be good > within Etoys also. > > > On Sep 8, 2009, at 9:48 AM, Timothy Falconer wrote: > >> Hi everyone, >> >> We're debating which squeakland.org account fields to include when >> people sign up for a showcase account. Such signup could occur >> within Etoys itself ("create an account, it's free!") or on the >> website itself. >> >> Some constraints that have come up in the current conversation: >> >> 1) we want to limit the fields within Etoys because of vertical >> space limitations in the dialog box >> >> 2) we want to limit the mandatory fields to allow quicker signup >> >> 3) we want to assure that private information from children remains >> private (last name, other descriptive stuff, perhaps photos) >> >> >> Here's the central issue at hand, from my perspective . . . >> >> Signup is the key moment for Squeakland and Etoys from a community- >> building, user research, and publicity standpoint. >> >> It's the time when we'll get the largest number of people to: >> >> 1. subscribe to our newsletter >> >> 2. tell us about themselves (where they live, how they're using >> etoys, etc) >> >> 3. allow us to later email them questionnaires or announcements >> (squeakfest), etc. >> >> >> The vast majority of people that signup for a showcase account WILL >> NOT join the forums, or separately subscribe to the newsletter, or >> visit the chat channel, or join a mailing list. >> >> The people that will do these things should be considered >> "enthusiasts", and hence, people that we really don't need to >> convince ("preaching to the choir"). >> >> We could allow people to come back to their profile page and add >> this stuff, but MOST won't. Only enthusiasts, people we don't need >> to convince. >> >> >> Imagine hundreds of people who are mildly curious . . . the signup >> to check out their daughter's project on the showcase, which is >> otherwise hidden. They're intrigued enough to download Etoys. >> Like MOST PEOPLE, they go to sleep and forget all about it for >> months. Then comes our quarterly newsletter, and they read a cool >> story about Uruguay. The open up Etoys again and start playing >> around again. Maybe this time they'll stick with it. >> >> This is the essence of publicity and marketing . . . the drumbeat, >> the heartbeat, of our own activity, reminding people we're still >> here and doing great stuff. >> >> >> So that said, here's the fields we're considering: >> >> * username >> * password (twice) >> * email address >> >> These are the bare minimum, and the only required fields. >> >> More fields: >> >> * first name >> * last name >> * tell us about yourself >> >> These are currently on the newsletter subscribe form. Currently, >> none of this collected information appears on the website. We can >> keep these fields private in account profiles as well, to protect >> children. Nearly everyone who signs up for the newsletter writes a >> very useful description about their location, interest in Etoys, >> affiliated organization, etc. We have hundreds of these comments, >> which is invaluable for our community-building work. I'm >> strongly in favor of keeping the "tell us about yourself" field and >> not showing it unless explicit permission is given. >> >> * checkbox for newsletter >> * checkbox for general announcements >> * checkbox for weekly showcase highlights >> >> We want as many YES's for all three as we can get. More YESes >> mean more audience. People can always opt-out from any mailing, >> but it's in our best interest to at least ask them for a YES. >> >> To keep the in-Etoys box short, we could leave these out, but the >> question remains . . . what's the default? If all NO's, then we >> lose a major source of people who would otherwise have said YES. >> >> (I know that most of us have grown accustomed to always saying NO >> to such forms, but in our case, with our worldwide enthusiastic >> audience, it's more likely people will say yes, than no.) >> >> >> Other fields we could add by flipping a switch: >> >> * organization >> * address >> * address_two >> * city >> * state >> * zip/postal code >> * country >> * time zone >> * home phone >> * work phone >> * want my friends to see my friends >> * show my first/last name to public >> * show my friend list to public >> * photo/avatar >> >> >> The address fields were used for squeakfest registration, but >> likely shouldn't appear in showcase accounts, except perhaps for >> country. Likewise with the phones . . . we shouldn't ask. >> >> The last three are things we could add to the profile, defaulting >> to the most private settings. The underlying software has much of >> the functionality of sites like Facebook, etc. My current plan is >> to allow people and groups to "friend" other people, which will >> allow them to see their private Etoys projects. Such a thing >> happens when you "tell a friend" and include a message that's email >> to someone, which is a great way to build community. >> >> >> Lastly, we have full questionnaire support as well, so we can add >> any questions we want, though only to the web profile. Again, >> most people won't go back to fill out their profile, but we *can* >> send an announcement saying "Tell us more about yourself, fill out >> this quick questionnaire", but only if someone has said YES to >> general announcements. >> >> Anyway, let me know what you think about all this. We want this to >> be a community conversation. >> >> Take care, >> TIm >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> squeakland mailing list >> squeakland(a)squeakland.org >> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland >

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Re: What about shipping DrGeo in Etoys?
by teefal 08 Sep '09

08 Sep '09

Here's a thought . . . 1. Get rid of "Basic" as a category 2. Put everything within it into Supply Bin, if it's not there already, or Graphics 3. Make a new category called "Apps", where we'll put standalone "microworlds" 4. Add DrGeo and Kedama to Apps 5. Possibly add everything in Games to Apps also, and get rid of that category 6. Make the object catalog wide enough so categories fit in one row 7. Add some padding around catalog items, so categories like Connectors don't look so cluttered. -------------------- m2f -------------------- (from forum) http://squeakland.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=10558#10558 -------------------- m2f --------------------

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Etoys in Fedora 11
by Bert Freudenberg 08 Sep '09

08 Sep '09

I finally upgraded my Sugar dev machine to Fedora 11 (well actually I had to reinstall, but that's another story). And I found that Etoys is there, ready for installation like any other Linux software, and it works great! Thank you, Gavin! I put screenshots of the installation process here: http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/How+to+install+Etoys+on+Fedora+11 The only issue I noticed with Etoys itself was that it was mis- categorized, in both the Software updater (was "Other desktops", should be "Education") and the Application menu (is "Sound & Video", should be "Education"). The browser plugin was not enabled automatically, I put workaround instructions in the How-To above. It just misses two symlinks. The proper way in a package postscript would be something like this I guess: in squeak-vm: alternatives --install /usr/lib/mozilla/plugins/npsqueak.so npsqueak.so /usr/lib/squeak/3.10-5/npsqueak.so 10000 in etoys: alternatives --install /usr/share/squeak/SqueakPlugin.image SqueakPlugin.image /usr/share/etoys/etoys.image 20000 The other odd issue is that installing the squeak-vm package adds a menu entry for "MySqueak" for no apparent reason. If it was named "Squeak" and when launched offered a way to open an image then this would make some sense, but for now it does nothing. The next release of the Squeak VM will actually display such a dialog (but still it should be renamed): http://squeakvm.org/svn/squeak/trunk/platforms/unix/cmake/squeak.sh.in - Bert -

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Controlling Arduino with Squeak Etoys
by Ricardo Moran 07 Sep '09

07 Sep '09

Hi folks! I've just wanted to show you the new stuff we've been working on for the past few weeks: an Etoy to interact with an Arduino board to control electronic components. In case you don't know what an Arduino is, you can check out this website: http://www.arduino.cc/. In summary, Arduino is a great hardware platform intended for artists, designers, hobbyists, and anyone interested in creating interactive objects or environments. And now we can control it with Squeak Etoys! It's not ready yet, but I hope we'll make it available sometime this week. If you're a robotic enthusiast I know you'll find this interesting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_IYlDbBlEs Check out our blog for more information: http://www.tecnodacta.com.ar/gira Have fun!

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etoys-dev September 2009