seaside May 2007

seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org

79 participants
116 discussions

Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007
by Boris Popov 01 May '07

01 May '07

Just talked to them about it, but they don't have access from here to fix it, hang tight, althouth I suspect its a sushi store and all tests that come with 2.6.x, Cheers! -Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry) ----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Tue May 01 10:15:04 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007 2007/5/1, Boris Popov <boris(a)deepcovelabs.com>: > > > > I will let you know when I find out myself, I should mention that this > version of GemStone is 64 bit only and they have no plans to add > continuations to 32 bit version from what I can tell. That also means no > running this on windows at the moment, hence the free sandbox provided by > GemStone. Check out seaside.GemStone.com too while you're at it ;) Error 500 for both all tests and Sushi Store :( http://www.squeaksource.com/GemStone.html > Cheers! > > -Boris > (Sent from a BlackBerry) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> > To: 'Seaside - general discussion' > <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> > Sent: Tue May 01 09:23:36 2007 > Subject: RE: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007 > > > GemStone 2.x free edition: 2gb ram limit, 4gb database size, > > 64 million objects, 2 gems max, no VW or VA connectivity - > > Squeak only, seaside and monticello built in, fastcgi > > support, database can be used as monticello repository, free > > sandbox website for those wanting to play with it hosted by > > GemStone, that's about it, but I'm sure GemStone will provide > > more details as well. > > > > Cheers! > > > > -Boris > > (Sent from a BlackBerry) > > Right on, Seaside just got really really really cool! Now just tell me > where to get it! > > Ramon Leon > http://onsmalltalk.com > > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside

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Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007
by Boris Popov 01 May '07

01 May '07

I will let you know when I find out myself, I should mention that this version of GemStone is 64 bit only and they have no plans to add continuations to 32 bit version from what I can tell. That also means no running this on windows at the moment, hence the free sandbox provided by GemStone. Check out seaside.GemStone.com too while you're at it ;) Cheers! -Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry) ----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: 'Seaside - general discussion' <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Tue May 01 09:23:36 2007 Subject: RE: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007 > GemStone 2.x free edition: 2gb ram limit, 4gb database size, > 64 million objects, 2 gems max, no VW or VA connectivity - > Squeak only, seaside and monticello built in, fastcgi > support, database can be used as monticello repository, free > sandbox website for those wanting to play with it hosted by > GemStone, that's about it, but I'm sure GemStone will provide > more details as well. > > Cheers! > > -Boris > (Sent from a BlackBerry) Right on, Seaside just got really really really cool! Now just tell me where to get it! Ramon Leon http://onsmalltalk.com _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside

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Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007
by Boris Popov 01 May '07

01 May '07

Yes, that's because its GemStone 64 bit version, not 32 bit one. Latest and greatest as they say, not to worry :) Cheers! -Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry) ----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Tue May 01 09:52:51 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007 Boris Popov wrote: GemStone 2.x free edition: 2gb ram limit, 4gb database size, 64 million objects, 2 gems max, no VW or VA connectivity - Squeak only, seaside and monticello built in, fastcgi support, database can be used as monticello repository, free sandbox website for those wanting to play with it hosted by GemStone, that's about it, but I'm sure GemStone will provide more details as well. Cheers! -Boris GemStone 2.x? That was released in, what, 1987? or 1986? I think GemStone 4.x was out in the early 90's. Are you sure you got that product rev number right? Those stats seem reminiscent of 4.x (but naturally without VW or VA GemBuilder). Why would they do a new Squeak GemBuilder for such an old product? (even if it's a stripped down GemBuilder, which I'm sure it is). Also, a few years ago I had to resurrect a GemStone 4.x system for a consulting gig. It wouldn't even run under Win XP without a lot of hoops being jumped through. One such hoop, if I recall, was the inability to work with the filesystem. And, I don't think Linux was even a gleam in anybody's eye for GemStone 2.x. Maybe I'll await further details, as I'm sure I'm missing something here. Nevin

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Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007
by Boris Popov 01 May '07

01 May '07

GemStone 2.x free edition: 2gb ram limit, 4gb database size, 64 million objects, 2 gems max, no VW or VA connectivity - Squeak only, seaside and monticello built in, fastcgi support, database can be used as monticello repository, free sandbox website for those wanting to play with it hosted by GemStone, that's about it, but I'm sure GemStone will provide more details as well. Cheers! -Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry) ----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Tue May 01 09:01:56 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] [ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007 OK, it's May 1st right now. When do we hear more about this? (for those folks not in Toronto) Nevin > Come to the GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions in room 201B from 5:30 > until 7:00 on Monday Apr 30th. > > You can meet the GemStone/S team, learn what's new in GS/S-64 2.2, > discuss the GemStone port of Seaside and Monticello, and witness the > unveiling of an edition of GemStone/S that's free -- even for commercial > use. (If you can't attend, you can watch for the announcement in your > inbox.) > > If you're in the Toronto area, you're welcome to drop in even if you're > not attending the conference. > > Dale > > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside

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[ANN] GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions 2007
by Dale Henrichs 01 May '07

01 May '07

Come to the GemStone BOF at Smalltalk Solutions in room 201B from 5:30 until 7:00 on Monday Apr 30th. You can meet the GemStone/S team, learn what's new in GS/S-64 2.2, discuss the GemStone port of Seaside and Monticello, and witness the unveiling of an edition of GemStone/S that's free -- even for commercial use. (If you can't attend, you can watch for the announcement in your inbox.) If you're in the Toronto area, you're welcome to drop in even if you're not attending the conference. Dale

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Re: [Seaside] Seaside, Traits, portability
by Boris Popov 01 May '07

01 May '07

Exactly, hence me trying to figure out a way to contribute directly versus relying on Michel so much. As far as GemStone, from what I've heard here so far they are staying away from modifying the base code, so porting should be more or less straightforward for them, but certainly, they do need someone like Michel to keep things evolving and improving if this takes off and I have a sense they understand that. Cheers! -Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry) ----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Tue May 01 05:08:04 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside, Traits, portability 2007/5/1, Boris Popov <boris(a)deepcovelabs.com>: > > > > Stephane, I'll tell you where exactly things have gone wrong for me. We are > using VisualWorks for a reason and for someone to suggest that I should ask > Cincom to get my money back on this list is somewhat interesting, because > the whole idea behind seaside like many have pointed out since is to have a > framework that's clean and portable. It's not, seriously. It was never meant to be. It's full of squeakisms. Don't get me started on the whole #asString -> #displayString issue, or where you can use Strings and where Symbols, and oh Squeak:Date and Seaside:Date, #asUnicode, #= on Sets or the ugly hack that is SeasidePlatformSupport. Don't even think about WideStrings and the whole sever adapter issue. Smalltalk is just not portable, that's sad but true. It works on VisualWorks because continuously a lot of effort is put into it by Michel. Up to now the Dolphin port was a one time thing done by Avi for money. Yes I know Esteban is working on a port of 2.7 but I haven't heard anything from from him since February. I have high hopes for the Gemstone port and if they can pay (!) someone like Michel maintaining it then chances of success are good. Don't get me wrong, I am very much interested in increasing portability. I'm just saying how things are. If you don't like something, we are open for your suggestions or even better: code. Cheers Philippe > We can't afford such arrogance simply > because we don't have enough traction and mindshare to justify it and the > only chance for us to ever get any of either is to work together instead of > doing what we're doing now. > > Having said all that, have you heard of anyone trying to port MC to > VisualWorks? Its something I'm going to play with on my flight back home > from Toronto after my talk, but thought I'd check here first in case someone > had started already. > > Avi, not sure if Colin is on this list, perhaps he might know of such > attempts? > > Cheers! > > -Boris > (Sent from a BlackBerry) > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > <seaside-bounces(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> > To: Seaside - general discussion > <seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org> > Sent: Tue May 01 01:31:05 2007 > Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside, Traits, portability > > just a last remark: > traits do not exist at run-time AT ALL. They are just structuring > static elements. > So this to me like saying that using MC is not good to run squeak > application. > I do not really understand the problem that traits have. May be I'm > too stupid to understand. > especially since for ports the code can be without traits. > > Stef > > On 30 avr. 07, at 19:45, Avi Bryant wrote: > > > On 4/29/07, Boris Popov <boris(a)deepcovelabs.com> wrote: > > > >> Why be so cynical? Different strokes for different folks. I've > >> felt many > >> times that you couldn't care less about anyone not using squeak > >> and it does > >> nothing but motivate me to unsubscribe from the list for good. > > > > Boris, please don't unsubscribe. I think you'll find the vast majority > > of people on this list care deeply about keeping Seaside portable > > across dialects - I would guess that at this point it's the largest > > portable Smalltalk codebase, and the largest cross-dialect community, > > and that's very important to me and to many others. > > > > For that reason and others, nobody who uses Seaside in production is > > seriously proposing that we make it depend on Traits - as far as I > > know, nobody uses Traits in production, period. By all means, let's > > have an academic discussion about the costs and benefits of Traits, > > but let's do it with a very clear understanding that it is indeed > > academic, and *not* a proposal that's going to affect mainline Seaside > > any time even vaguely soon. > > > > Avi > > _______________________________________________ > > Seaside mailing list > > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > > > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > > > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > > > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org > http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside > > _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside(a)lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside

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seaside May 2007