Not quite still. VMware Player is free and users don't need to install Ubuntu themselves, they could download GemStone's Seaside VM with everything included and configured, which as a matter of fact may be easier than installing and setting up VisualWorks from scratch for instance. All dialects deserve a mention and quick start sections IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org To: Seaside - general discussion seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org Sent: Fri Jul 27 18:26:13 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi Monty, you're correct but the goal of the book is Seaside. Next, VMWare isn't free and I would not expect my customers to purchase VMWare, install Ubuntu, and finally install a Smalltalk environment and Seaside packages. I prefer one to focus on installing the Smalltalk environment and the Seaside package(s). Monty, just because I can use VMWare doesn't mean that it's necessary or needed for learning Seaside. In short, the book should be focused on learning Seaside in the native development environment whether it be VisualWorks, Dolphin, and Squeak environments. Now, if my deployable image is VisualWorks or Dolphin, how would installing VMWare satisfy these users?
-Conrad
On 7/27/07, Monty Williams monty.williams@gemstone.com wrote:
I'm not sure your restriction makes sense in today's world. You can happily run Ubuntu Server Linux in a VMWare environment on a MacBook or other machine, and use Squeak on the native environment as a development platform.
GLASS (GemStone, Linux, Apache, Seaside, and Smalltalk) as a deployment environment (instead of LAMP) will also run in a virtualized machine. http://seaside.gemstone.com/ss/ is running in a virtualized Xen domU with 768MB of RAM and a 20GB disk image. The underlying hardware is a dual-processor Opteron 252 2.6GHz with 2GB of RAM which also runs GemStone's other external websites, mail, a Confluence wiki, and DNS.
-- Monty
From: Conrad Taylor [mailto:conradwt@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 5:27 PM To: Seaside - general discussion
Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi, I just wouldn't want to introduce something into a book that's not supported on all the major platforms. At this time, it doesn't support Mac OS X but it support Linux and Windows. Also, Dolphin Smalltalk only supports the Windows platform from my understanding. However, it does have support Seaside 2.7 on Dolphin Smalltalk X6. This is very good to hear and one can find more information hear:
http://dolphinseaside.blogspot.com/
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, Boris Popov boris@deepcovelabs.com wrote:
Except GemStone in this context is way more than just a database, its also
the execution platform for seaside itself so would have to be accounted for throughout IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org <
seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org>
To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org> Sent: Sun Jul 22 16:58:15 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi James, I agree with you 100% addressing all the versions of Smalltalk.
However, I would save Gemstone/S for the database integration parts of the book but Dolphin Smalltalk would added to the installation parts of the book. Anyway, in the outline that I proposed, I assumed that the reader had
programming proficiency but I added the "Introduction to Smalltalk"
appendix for people that do not.
It would be GREAT to incorporate something like this in the forthcoming
books on Seaside.
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, James Foster <Smalltalk@jgfoster.net <
mailto:Smalltalk@jgfoster.net> > wrote:
I believe that all dialects of Smalltalk that support Seaside (you
left
out Dolphin and GemStone) have a no-cost edition. It seems that addressing each of these alternatives would be valuable. James Blake wrote: > Hey, guys, > > I'm creating an outline and some samples for a Seaside book
and am
> wondering: Should I concern myself with Visual Works? That is to
say:
> If I base the book on Squeak, I know everyone can get it for
free but
> at the same time, some may choose VW over Squeak for their work. > > How much accomodation should I make for VW? Obviously, I'll
want
> to check over the examples in VW and make sure they work, but
apart
> from that? > > ===Blake=== > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org > http://lists.squeakfoundation
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org http://lists.squeakfoundation < http://lists.squeakfoundation>
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org
http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
_______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Hi, I had to install one package when I got started with Seaside on VisualWorks and this process took about 5 minutes or so. Next, VMWare seems to only support Intel based Macs. Thus, this will not work on non-Intel based Macs. Also, with the forthcoming VMWare Fusion, it's slated for Intel based Macs. In any case, agree with Boris that there needs to be converage for the various dialects. Does the Gemstone Seaside VM work with VisualWorks?
-Conrad
On 7/27/07, Boris Popov boris@deepcovelabs.com wrote:
Not quite still. VMware Player is free and users don't need to install Ubuntu themselves, they could download GemStone's Seaside VM with everything included and configured, which as a matter of fact may be easier than installing and setting up VisualWorks from scratch for instance. All dialects deserve a mention and quick start sections IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org To: Seaside - general discussion seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org Sent: Fri Jul 27 18:26:13 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi Monty, you're correct but the goal of the book is Seaside. Next, VMWare isn't free and I would not expect my customers to purchase VMWare, install Ubuntu, and finally install a Smalltalk environment and Seaside packages. I prefer one to focus on installing the Smalltalk environment and the Seaside package(s). Monty, just because I can use VMWare doesn't mean that it's necessary or needed for learning Seaside. In short, the book should be focused on learning Seaside in the native development environment whether it be VisualWorks, Dolphin, and Squeak environments. Now, if my deployable image is VisualWorks or Dolphin, how would installing VMWare satisfy these users?
-Conrad
On 7/27/07, Monty Williams monty.williams@gemstone.com wrote:
I'm not sure your restriction makes sense in today's world. You can
happily
run Ubuntu Server Linux in a VMWare environment on a MacBook or other machine, and use Squeak on the native environment as a development
platform.
GLASS (GemStone, Linux, Apache, Seaside, and Smalltalk) as a deployment environment (instead of LAMP) will also run in a virtualized machine. http://seaside.gemstone.com/ss/ is running in a virtualized Xen domU with 768MB of RAM and a 20GB disk image. The underlying hardware is a dual-processor Opteron 252 2.6GHz with 2GB of RAM which also runs
GemStone's
other external websites, mail, a Confluence wiki, and DNS.
-- Monty
From: Conrad Taylor [mailto:conradwt@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 5:27 PM To: Seaside - general discussion
Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi, I just wouldn't want to introduce something into a book that's not supported on all the major platforms. At this time, it doesn't support
Mac
OS X but it support Linux and Windows. Also, Dolphin Smalltalk only supports the Windows platform from my understanding. However, it does
have
support Seaside 2.7 on Dolphin Smalltalk X6. This is very good to hear
and
one can find more information hear:
http://dolphinseaside.blogspot.com/
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, Boris Popov boris@deepcovelabs.com wrote:
Except GemStone in this context is way more than just a database, its
also
the execution platform for seaside itself so would have to be accounted
for
throughout IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org <
seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org>
To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org> Sent: Sun Jul 22 16:58:15 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi James, I agree with you 100% addressing all the versions of
Smalltalk.
However, I would save Gemstone/S for the database integration parts of
the
book but Dolphin Smalltalk would added to the installation parts of the book. Anyway, in the outline that I proposed, I assumed that the reader
had
programming proficiency but I added the "Introduction to Smalltalk"
appendix for people that do not.
It would be GREAT to incorporate something like this in the forthcoming
books on Seaside.
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, James Foster <Smalltalk@jgfoster.net <
mailto:Smalltalk@jgfoster.net> > wrote:
I believe that all dialects of Smalltalk that support Seaside
(you
left
out Dolphin and GemStone) have a no-cost edition. It seems that addressing each of these alternatives would be valuable. James Blake wrote: > Hey, guys, > > I'm creating an outline and some samples for a Seaside
book
and am
> wondering: Should I concern myself with Visual Works? That is
to
say:
> If I base the book on Squeak, I know everyone can get it for
free but
> at the same time, some may choose VW over Squeak for their
work.
> > How much accomodation should I make for VW? Obviously,
I'll
want
> to check over the examples in VW and make sure they work, but
apart
> from that? > > ===Blake=== >
> Seaside mailing list > Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org > http://lists.squeakfoundation
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> >
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org http://lists.squeakfoundation < http://lists.squeakfoundation>
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org
http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org
http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Hi, I ask because I use VisualWorks in development. Next, I'm plan to deploy with VisualWorks as well. -Conrad
On 7/28/07, James Foster Smalltalk@jgfoster.net wrote:
Conrad Taylor wrote:
Does the Gemstone Seaside VM work with VisualWorks?
Yes, for certain definitions of "work with." But why do you ask?
James _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
If you plan to deploy your Seaside application with VisualWorks, then were you thinking of using GemStone just for persistence? If so, then the traditional GBS (GemBuilder for Smalltalk) works just fine with VisualWorks. Note, however, that the no-cost "Web Edition" of GemStone does not include GBS. To use GBS you would need another license.
James
Conrad Taylor wrote:
Hi, I ask because I use VisualWorks in development. Next, I'm plan to deploy with VisualWorks as well.
-Conrad
On 7/28/07, * James Foster* <Smalltalk@jgfoster.net mailto:Smalltalk@jgfoster.net> wrote:
Conrad Taylor wrote: > Does the Gemstone Seaside VM work with VisualWorks? Yes, for certain definitions of "work with." But why do you ask? James _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation <mailto:Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation>.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Hi Boris, what host OS does one use for GemStone's Seaside VM if using VMware Player? I ask this question because there's no direct support for Mac OS X. -Conrad
On 7/27/07, Boris Popov boris@deepcovelabs.com wrote:
Not quite still. VMware Player is free and users don't need to install Ubuntu themselves, they could download GemStone's Seaside VM with everything included and configured, which as a matter of fact may be easier than installing and setting up VisualWorks from scratch for instance. All dialects deserve a mention and quick start sections IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org < seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfouseaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org ndation.org seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org> To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside@lists.squeakfoundationseaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org .org seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org> Sent: Fri Jul 27 18:26:13 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi Monty, you're correct but the goal of the book is Seaside. Next, VMWare isn't free and I would not expect my customers to purchase VMWare, install Ubuntu, and finally install a Smalltalk environment and Seaside packages. I prefer one to focus on installing the Smalltalk environment and the Seaside package(s). Monty, just because I can use VMWare doesn't mean that it's necessary or needed for learning Seaside. In short, the book should be focused on learning Seaside in the native development environment whether it be VisualWorks, Dolphin, and Squeak environments. Now, if my deployable image is VisualWorks or Dolphin, how would installing VMWare satisfy these users?
-Conrad
On 7/27/07, Monty Williams monty.williams@gemstone.com wrote:
I'm not sure your restriction makes sense in today's world. You can
happily
run Ubuntu Server Linux in a VMWare environment on a MacBook or other machine, and use Squeak on the native environment as a development
platform.
GLASS (GemStone, Linux, Apache, Seaside, and Smalltalk) as a deployment environment (instead of LAMP) will also run in a virtualized machine. http://seaside.gemstone.com/ss/ is running in a virtualized Xen domU
with
768MB of RAM and a 20GB disk image. The underlying hardware is a dual-processor Opteron 252 2.6GHz with 2GB of RAM which also runs
GemStone's
other external websites, mail, a Confluence wiki, and DNS.
-- Monty
From: Conrad Taylor [mailto:conradwt@gmail.com conradwt@gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, July 22, 2007 5:27 PM To: Seaside - general discussion
Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi, I just wouldn't want to introduce something into a book that's not supported on all the major platforms. At this time, it doesn't support
Mac
OS X but it support Linux and Windows. Also, Dolphin Smalltalk only supports the Windows platform from my understanding. However, it does
have
support Seaside 2.7 on Dolphin Smalltalk X6. This is very good to hear
and
one can find more information hear:
http://dolphinseaside.blogspot http://dolphinseaside.blogspot.com/
.com/ http://dolphinseaside.blogspot.com/
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, Boris Popov boris@deepcovelabs.com wrote:
Except GemStone in this context is way more than just a database, its
also
the execution platform for seaside itself so would have to be accounted
for
throughout IMHO.
Cheers!
-Boris (Sent from a BlackBerry)
----- Original Message ----- From: seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfouseaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org
ndation.org seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org <
seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfouseaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org
ndation.org seaside-bounces@lists.squeakfoundation.org>
To: Seaside - general discussion <seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org> Sent: Sun Jul 22 16:58:15 2007 Subject: Re: [Seaside] Seaside book
Hi James, I agree with you 100% addressing all the versions of
Smalltalk.
However, I would save Gemstone/S for the database integration parts of
the
book but Dolphin Smalltalk would added to the installation parts of the book. Anyway, in the outline that I proposed, I assumed that the reader
had
programming proficiency but I added the "Introduction to Smalltalk"
appendix for people that do not.
It would be GREAT to incorporate something like this in the
forthcoming
books on Seaside.
-Conrad
On 7/22/07, James Foster <Smalltalk@jgfoster.net <
mailto:Smalltalk@jgfoster.net Smalltalk@jgfoster.net> > wrote:
I believe that all dialects of Smalltalk that support Seaside
(you
left
out Dolphin and GemStone) have a no-cost edition. It seems
that
addressing each of these alternatives would be valuable. James Blake wrote: > Hey, guys, > > I'm creating an outline and some samples for a Seaside
book
and am
> wondering: Should I concern myself with Visual Works? That
is to
say:
> If I base the book on Squeak, I know everyone can get it for
free but
> at the same time, some may choose VW over Squeak for their
work.
> > How much accomodation should I make for VW? Obviously,
I'll
want
> to check over the examples in VW and make sure they work,
but
apart
> from that? > > ===Blake=== > _______________________________________________ > Seaside mailing list > Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org > http://lists.squeakfoundation
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
> > _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org http://lists.squeakfoundation < http://lists.squeakfoundation>
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation .org
http://lists.squeakfoundationhttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seasidehttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org.orgSeaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundationhttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seasidehttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org.orgSeaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundationhttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside .org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seasidehttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org.orgSeaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundationhttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside .org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seasidehttp://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Conrad Taylor wrote:
Hi Boris, what host OS does one use for GemStone's Seaside VM if using VMware Player? I ask this question because there's no direct support for Mac OS X.
-Conrad
I'm running a beta of GemStone/S 64-bit Web Edition in VMware Server (http://www.vmware.com/download/server/) on Windows XP. The guest OS (SUSE Linux 64-bit) gets its own IP address, and a browser in Windows happily displays pages served by Apache on Linux. It looks like VMware Fusion for the Macintosh (http://www.vmware.com/beta/fusion/index.html) will be available soon.
James
Hi, is the beta of GemStone/S 64-bit Web Edition available to the public? -Conrad
On 8/2/07, James Foster Smalltalk@jgfoster.net wrote:
Conrad Taylor wrote:
Hi Boris, what host OS does one use for GemStone's Seaside VM if using VMware Player? I ask this question because there's no direct support for Mac OS X.
-Conrad
I'm running a beta of GemStone/S 64-bit Web Edition in VMware Server (http://www.vmware.com/download/server/) on Windows XP. The guest OS (SUSE Linux 64-bit) gets its own IP address, and a browser in Windows happily displays pages served by Apache on Linux. It looks like VMware Fusion for the Macintosh (http://www.vmware.com/beta/fusion/index.html) will be available soon.
James _______________________________________________ Seaside mailing list Seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org http://lists.squeakfoundation.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/seaside
Conrad Taylor wrote:
Hi, is the beta of GemStone/S 64-bit Web Edition available to the public?
Not yet. The broader distribution is being held back by until a few more tools are finished. Did you submit a request to gssbeta@gemstone.com? Did you get a reply? There are a couple people helping with tools (OmniBrowser, Monticello, etc.). Check out Dale's blog at http://gemstonesoup.wordpress.com/ (as well as the official site at http://seaside.gemstone.com/).
James
seaside@lists.squeakfoundation.org