squeakland April 2010

squeakland@lists.squeakfoundation.org

12 participants
22 discussions

Guias Rapidas de Etoys
by kharness＠illinois.edu 22 Jun '10

22 Jun '10

Hello, Guias Rapidas de Etoys are Spanish translations of the Quick Guides by Sdenka Salas Pilco of OLPCPuno-Peru. EtoysIllinois is grateful for her work and for allowing us post them on our site. http://www.etoysillinois.org/library.php?tags=Guias%20Rapidas%20de%20Etoys Find out more about the OLPC project in Peru: http://olpcpuno.ning.com If you are working on translations of the guides, please let me know and we could share the work. If you provide translations, I will make the interactive guide projects. I know the format details very well. Regards, Kathleen Harness

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Re: [squeakland] kedama tutorial by linda kao
by Korakurider 21 Jun '10

21 Jun '10

It is really great we finally "rescue" historical contents! The tutorial have example projects attached. Where will we maintain them (revised for newer version of Etoys)? of course Showcase is one option, but it seems better if flossmanuals can manage such materials for translation and distribution, /Korakurider On Thu, Nov 26, 2009 at 5:46 AM, Kim Rose <kim.rose(a)vpri.org> wrote: > Yes, this work was created by Viewpoints and a graduate student at UCLA who > was an intern for us at the time. > We hope it can prove helpful to any Etoys users. > > Kim > > On Nov 25, 2009, at 10:22 AM, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote: > >> At Wed, 25 Nov 2009 18:25:56 +0100, >> Karl Ramberg wrote: >>> >>> On 2009-11-25 18:08, Yoshiki Ohshima wrote: >>> >>> The "source" of the PDF version, the Word document file was found. >>> So, I uploaded the file to: >>> >>> >>> http://wiki.squeakland.org/pages/viewpageattachments.action?pageId=16844 >>> >>> -- Yoshiki >>> _______________________________________________ >>> squeakland mailing list >>> squeakland(a)squeakland.org >>> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland >>> >>> Great, >>> can we use this on http://en.flossmanuals.net/ ? >> >> Kim (the executive director of VPRI, who funded making the >> document) says it is perfectly fine to make it public so it should be >> fine to use it for the FLOSS manual. >> >> -- Yoshiki >> _______________________________________________ >> squeakland mailing list >> squeakland(a)squeakland.org >> http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland > > > _______________________________________________ > Squeakland mailing list > Squeakland(a)squeakland.org > http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo/squeakland >

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seymour papert joins squeakland
by Timothy Falconer 20 Jun '10

20 Jun '10

Hi everyone, I'm very happy to announce that Seymour Papert is now a part of the Squeakland Foundation: http://squeakland.org/about/people/ The photo is a recent one of Seymour. He's doing well, reading the New York Times each morning, working on projects from home. We are of course thrilled to have him part of the team. Take care, Tim -- Timothy Falconer Squeakland Foundation http://squeakland.org 610-797-3100 -- "Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget

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Etoys developer chat today
by Bert Freudenberg 11 May '10

11 May '10

Please join our weekly Etoys developer chat today. Follow this link to see the time in your local time zone: http://tinyurl.com/3xfx4es To participate, enter your name as nickname on http://chat.squeakland.org/ and press "Login". Then say hi :-) Alternatively, use an IRC client of your choice to join #etoys on irc.freenode.net Everyone is welcome! - Bert -

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Test for DrGeo
by Hilaire Fernandes 29 Apr '10

29 Apr '10

Request for test with Etoys Monticello enabled I have made a lot of change to the drgeo code base: a better user interface, simplification of the interface... It can be loaded from Monticello http://www.squeaksource.com/DrGeoII.html It is still work in progress, and package division is needed Once loaded in Etoys, to start a DrGeo instance: DrGeo service openInWorld Ringing bell... -- http://blog.ofset.org/hilaire

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Google Group Re: [squeakland] Etoys developer chat log
by Korakurider 27 Apr '10

27 Apr '10

On Tue, Apr 27, 2010 at 9:09 AM, Bert Freudenberg <bert(a)freudenbergs.de> wrote: > * Maybe move all Squeakland mailing lists and forums to Google? would get rid of the forum spam issues Really? My recent experience was bad because of spam mails. See also http://ejohn.org/blog/google-groups-is-dead/ /Korakurider

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Etoys developer chat log
by Bert Freudenberg 27 Apr '10

27 Apr '10

Hi all, we had another nice chat today. Topics included * what does @HELP achieve in the #etoys channel * how to fix up the ancestry of Monticello packages we create * and what to do about remaining packaging differences * how to get more reliable #etoys logs (perhaps same as #squeak?) * how to call next release? The update stream uses "etoys4.1" for now, the bug tracker "etoys 2010". "Etoys 5" would be an option too. Discussion welcome. * lack of documentation on extending Etoys, or even of its overall design * progress on User Manual * discussing Ricardo's GSoC project (Randy will set up a Google Group) * Maybe move all Squeakland mailing lists and forums to Google? would get rid of the forum spam issues Next chat will be next Monday, same time and place. But the channel is open 24/7, you can try to catch us any time (and use @ALL or @HELP to get our attention). Full log below. Once we have regular logging I won't have to spam the list with this anymore ... - Bert - <matmo> hi all <ritaf> hi <bertf> hi folks --> hilaire (~hilaire(a)bon74-1-88-184-136-97.fbx.proxad.net) has joined #etoys <Guest85605> hi <bertf> Randy: try a longer nick name, append soem characters <jecel> hello <hilaire> hello <bertf> "randy" is probably registered to another person <-> Guest85605 is now known as randycat <randycat> that worked <bertf> randycat: nice :) <bertf> cool, so let's start <bertf> did anyone try the updates? <randycat> The official notice of Richo's google award will be any minute - I hope nothing changed <bertf> yes, that's awesome. I hear there was quite some discussion at ESUG which projects to support, right? <randycat> it was tense <bertf> but he's doing great, good choice <kencausey> bertf: ah, good call <bertf> does anyone have anything specific we need to talk about? --> squeaker761 (~40379e74(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys <bertf> kencausey: you mean the web irc thing or what? "maintain" <kencausey> yes, the web chat client <-> squeaker761 is now known as bander <bertf> ah, bander, hi <bander> hi <bertf> kencausey: well it;s working for now <bander> just listening today :-) <kencausey> true <kencausey> bander: good luck with that. ;) <bertf> kencausey: also, tim said he will continue to maintain the servers for now <kencausey> sure <kencausey> What does the @HELP prefix actually do? <bertf> it makes my icon bounce ;) <kencausey> For example, does the bot suggest alternate help sources? Unfortunately people that use it rarely get answered. <bertf> we all entered that as custom-highlight to our clients <bertf> nothing to do with the bot <kencausey> ah, I see, not bot related then <bertf> bander: I did have a question for you <bertf> I published a recategorization to the update stream <bander> sure <bertf> but comparing teh packages now to the trunk ones there are still a lot of differences <bertf> like, where did flash go? <bander> No clue. 3.9 road kill? <bander> We should restore it <bertf> do you think we should just make our own packages now? without ancestry? <bertf> I thought about "adopting" some existing packages <bander> How about adopting an older version? <bertf> :) <bertf> I thought about doing that with the earlies ones I can find <bertf> in the 39a repo <bander> The alternative is to move it into separate packages <bertf> flash you mean <bander> Yes <kencausey> seems like the better plan to me --> BackOrder (~4ad28298(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys <bander> I can look at that if it helps <kencausey> it's time to transition to the core releases plus a basic built from the core with packages added <kencausey> then etoys can start with the core and go from there <bertf> yeah. well. I was so happy to have a reasonably categorized version today at 4 am that I published it <kencausey> sure <bertf> kencausey: yes that is the long-tem plan <bertf> bander: that would be excellent -*- saijanai_ unlurks and starts reading backlog <bander> I'll see if I can find some time this week <bertf> at least now we have some good tools to work with -*- kencausey resists talking about non-etoys issues <bertf> good boy ;) <bertf> BackOrder: hi - do we know you? <bander> IanT perhaps? <bertf> no idea, that nick doesn't ring a bell <bertf> in any case I want this to be done asap so we can start integrating the actual patches lingering on the tracker <bander> Actually, I think we should keep the current version of the Flash package in the Etoys repo for the time being <bertf> oh definitely <bertf> I want all packages to at least have a copy in the etoys repo <bander> Sounds reasonable <bertf> so the etoys release will only contain packages from there <bertf> which might have a master elsewhere but still <ritaf> bertf: in Portugal, they are using an old Etoys version, 3.9 but they want move to Etoys 4.0. They say they did some work on the older version and the biggest problem is to do it all again for the new Etoys. What would you recommend for them to so? And especially, is the new update stream helping there? <randycat> will any of the changes you are planning effect what Ricardo Moran creates for GSoC? <bertf> ritaf: depends on what work they did <ritaf> bertf: I don't know the details, I will ask. <ritaf> bertf: maybe I shold just invite Luis for the next meeting <bander> ritaf: the best thing to do would be to get them involved in the dev process <bertf> randycat: shouldn't. we're not planning to do any big changes for this summer's release <bertf> randycat: what we're talking about is just a different way to organize the code, not actually modifying teh code itself <bertf> not in a big way anyhow <bander> sorry folks, gotta run - eliot's dragging me out for lunch --> karlram (~51aa9a7e(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has joined #etoys <karlram> hello <bertf> bander: thanks for stopping by <ritaf> hi karlram <bertf> karlram: hi. awesome :) <karlram> hi <bertf> you just missed andreas, we were talking about the new packages <karlram> ah <bertf> kencausey: do you have an idea for better loggin this channel? <BackOrder> Hi guys! Yes, I am Ian Trudel. :) <karlram> will there be logs ? <karlram> hi <bertf> karlram: sure <karlram> cool <kencausey> bertf: well, we might be able to invite clog as long as you want total logging and not something directly controllable. <bertf> karlram: I just emailed you the backlog <karlram> thanks <kencausey> that woudl put logs at tunes.org/~nef/logs/ <bertf> kencausey: that would be awesome. just like for #squeak right? <kencausey> BackOrder: Hi Ian <kencausey> bertf: yes, trick is remembering who to contact <BackOrder> I decided to take a peek in this chatroom after Bert's invitation on Squeak-Dev. <kencausey> Brian Rice might know, shall I look into it? <bertf> kencausey: please, yes. thanks <bertf> I removed the broken "sm" log link from the topic today <bertf> ok, logs, there was somethign else I wanted to ask ... <bertf> ah, yes. karlram: I notiuced you added changesets to the tracker but did not mark teh issues "resolved" <bertf> are you happy with the way the tracker works now? <bertf> or with the way we're using it? <karlram> the process is a little unclear <bertf> well we're abusing the system <bertf> let me dig out the link <karlram> i'm not sure what the diffrent thing stand for <bertf> http://wiki.squeakland.org/display/sq/Process <bertf> well it's unfortunate that they do not mean what they usually mean <karlram> ok, i'll read that <-- BackOrder (~4ad28298(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (Ping timeout)) <bertf> that's how we tried to operate, though it wasn't working too well I think <karlram> but etoys 5 is our next release ? <karlram> next target <bertf> to me it feels more liek a minor release --> BackOrder (~ian(a)130-152.sh.cgocable.ca) has joined #etoys <matmo> got to go soon. Copy of my notes re AV on Ubuntu Karmic (will be on swiki alter in the week): http://pastebin.com/J5E1jgK1 <bertf> matmo: thanks ! <karlram> it minor in some ways <karlram> major if we get it up to squeak 4.1 <bertf> no chance <karlram> :-) <bertf> there are way too many issues to make that leap that soon :) <karlram> ok <saijanai_> question: is anyone working on how to make it easier to extend etoys? I'm just trying to nibble around the edges and it looks somewhat daunting <bertf> so the development version we're working on now I'd like to call 4.1. <jecel> And I would say there is work to be done on the Squeak side as well, so it would be better to aim for Squeak 4.2 or something like that <bertf> saijanai_: no one really. help welcome :) <saijanai_> well, I'd like to, but I'm slow at digesting, so no promises <karlram> name the issues you have with extending ? <bertf> sure. but let us know where you feel you're hitting a wall <saijanai_> getting started is the first issue. NOt sure where to start <bertf> almost everythignis possible, but seldomly obvious and sometimes not trivial <karlram> there should be some example project around.... <bertf> saijanai_: you wanted to add your own tiles IIRC right? <saijanai_> right. I think you were the one who sent me info on the GSoC project? or was that someone else? <bertf> not sure <saijanai_> if youre not the one doing the work ont eh GSoC then it was someone else :-) <bertf> the work is dan by Ricardo <bertf> s/dan/done/ <saijanai_> ah, OK, so Ricardo is the one who sent me the info <randycat> Ricardo is posting his progress on SqueakSource <bertf> there is a lot of oral history around squeak ... <bertf> some things seem to never have been written up <kencausey> many things <saijanai_> and by the time someone tries, they've changed beyond recognition, or such is my impression <bertf> which is both good and bad - good because the system is evolving, bad because it's harder to catch up <matmo> how's the etoys book coming along? <bertf> the ref manual? <matmo> y <bertf> ritaf would know <bertf> last time I checked it looked pretty good <karlram> bertf:true <bertf> but it is a user's manual, not a developer's one <ritaf> we have most of the text done, now one issue is formatting, so that it is better to read and then reviewing. <bertf> kencausey: do you know which paper outlined the general principles of Etoys? <bertf> like, the fat object model etc <saijanai_> yeah, I've got many plans concerning etoys. The Scratch in Second Life could be extended in many ways (direct manipulation of prims via packet injection instead of LSL scripts, for example) <bertf> saijanai_: basically, in etoys you only have a a single kind of object. no classes/inheritance etc. <bertf> that object is called "Player" <saijanai_> right. Based off of the Self design, with much kludging to make it work in Squeak <bertf> everything you want to be scriptable, you must add to Player <saijanai_> OK, sorta got that from what Ricardo told me <bertf> no, Morphic comes from Self, but Etoys is yet another layer <jecel> There is an indirection compared to Self - a Player may have several Costumes <saijanai_> ah, OK. my bad <bertf> right, what jecel said <bertf> so when you make an Etoys script it looks liek you are working with a morph, but in fact you are working with a Player <randycat> bertf: I want to start a place where teachers and developers can download and discuss Ricardo's tools. What do you think about Google Groups? <kencausey> bertf: no, jecel? -*- kencausey checks new blue book <kencausey> hmm, too old perhapos <bertf> randycat: hmm. good question <saijanai_> I'm willing to participate in such a discussion groiup. <jecel> kencausey: I have never read a paper about the Etoys architecture, but did see one about Tweak which has some features in common <karlram> I posted a simple changeset that adds camera tracking to Etoys on Etoys-dev <bertf> randycat: you think the squeakland list would be inappropriate? <kencausey> jecel: yeah, I'm not sure what paper bertf is refering too <bertf> kencausey: maybe the one in my head ;) <karlram> must be some paper from Alan <jecel> is the squeakland list still linked to some web forums? <bertf> we'd have to ask Scott <karlram> he has some stuff on the vpri.org <bertf> jecel: yes, though they are just spam repositories <randycat> I though Google Groups might be more approachable by teachers and easier to archive. <jecel> bertf: I was afraid of that <bertf> randycat: then we have a problem with the squeakland list, which is supposed to be approachable by teachers <kencausey> randycat: I like running our own tools whenever possible, but google groups seems reasonable for this case. <saijanai_> http://www.pcs.cnu.edu/~rcaton/ESUG/ESUG.html is the link Ricardo sent me <karlram> saianai> ask question on etoys-dev mail list when you run into issus <karlram> issues <saijanai_> that's how I got the link :-) <bertf> randycat: how about moving the whole squeakland list to google groups? (just speculating, not actually proposing it yet) <bertf> ritaf: any comment? ^^^ <randycat> saijanai: I set u that link, but it is just a web page <saijanai_> Ricardo? <saijanai_> thanks <bertf> saijanai_: Ricardo is doing the work, and Randy is mentoring him <ritaf> bertf: let me think about that. I don't know yet what that would mean. <saijanai_> ah, OK. Misread who sent what to whom then <saijanai_> thanks anyways :-) <bertf> ritaf: well for one it would mean we don't have to maintain the lists on our own <randycat> bertf: can the squeakland list do all that Google Groups can in one environment? <bertf> also, google is good about filtering spam <bertf> randycat: I have no idea, I'm not too familiar with google groups <saijanai_> google can require membership so you can just ban spammers <saijanai_> I think <kencausey> bertf: picking your battles seems like a good idea to me, running your own listserv is a bit of time sink <karlram> bertf is there much spam on squeakland lists ? <jecel> The Cobalt people use google groups and there is a new Smalltalk Research list there <bertf> karlram: no, but on the forums there is <karlram> ok, i never use the frums <karlram> forums.... <bertf> does google groups have a forums-like view? --> scottwal (~scottwal(a)99-40-5-235.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) has joined #etoys <bertf> oh, hi scottwal :) <karlram> hi <scottwal> hi! [only here for a couple of moments -- have to head back out :-( ] <bertf> we were wondering if there was a paper about the general architecture of Etoys? <scottwal> Almost surely not... <jecel> Yes, you can use google groups as a web forum (I do for over half of the list there in which I participate) <bertf> or any documentation really <randycat> bertf: Google groups has custom web pages, discussion threads, upload and download files - all in one package <bertf> jecel: that sounds like a win <kencausey> bertf: google groups can be used entirely through the web, so I think it supplants the idea of a web forum <bertf> right. I'd love to have something I can use either as mailign list or as forum <karlram> I have to read books to my daugther... Bye <ritaf> that sounds nice to me. <bertf> karlram: thanks <scottwal> and I have to pick up my daughter from the airport... Bye <-- karlram (~51aa9a7e(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC (EOF)) <jecel> I participate in an equal number of lists at yahoo groups and it is pretty reasonable too <bertf> thanks to you too scott3 <ritaf> bye scott! <-- scottwal (~scottwal(a)99-40-5-235.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net) has quit (Client Quit) <bertf> jecel do you see any advantage to yahoo? <bertf> (I've never seen it I guess) <kencausey> Google seems like a better choice from a stability standpoint, at least this year <randycat> bertf: ESUG uses Google Groups <bertf> randycat: seems like a win to me <jecel> bertf: I started the self-interest list on eGroups and that got bought by Yahoo. I think the two alternatives are roughly equivalent <bertf> okay. Who volunteers to set this up? <randycat> bertf: I will <bertf> randycat: for the gsoc you mean <randycat> yes <matmo> bye all <bertf> okay. I meant moving over the squeakland list and archives etc. <randycat> bertf: we could try it for gsoc and see how we like it <bertf> (assuming archives can be imported) <bertf> randycat: good idea <jecel> One great thing about the yahoo groups (google might have this too, but I am not an administrator for any list there) is that you can moderate just the first email from each new user, and once you see they are not spammers you let them post without moderation <bertf> jecel: that's a feature we wanted to have for a long time <jecel> Yeah, that reduces my workload to one email to look at every two weeks <bertf> ritaf: can you ask marta how she would feel about moving the america-latina list? <bertf> these are the lists we currently have http://lists.squeakland.org/mailman/listinfo <ritaf> bertf: ok <bertf> well, excellent. thanks guys - anything else we would want to discuss today? <saijanai_> Just checked with John Dougan. Google has the same feature regarding moderation <randycat> jecel: I just checked - there are management tools for postings <bertf> saijanai_: thanks <bertf> matmo: thanks! <jecel> randycat: great! <randycat> bertf: should I set up a Goggle Group for GSoC - once Ricardo's award is official? <bertf> randycat: yes please. sounds like a good experiment <bertf> I need someone to lead this discussion next week - I'll be in the air. <randycat> OK - goodbye everyone and thanks <bertf> thanks randycat. bye <-- randycat (~cebcff48(a)skylab.immuexa.com) has quit (Quit: CGI:IRC) <bertf> or just come here next Monday, same place and time, and have a nice chat :) <bertf> thanks everyone! <saijanai_> cheers <BackOrder> So long, folks. :)

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ENC: stepping down from squeakland
by Marta Voelcker 26 Apr '10

26 Apr '10

Hi Tim, We had great achievements in 2009, I would like to thank you especially for your efforts on organizing Squeakfest Brasil 2009, for coming to Porto Alegre to help me make it happen, and even for going to Olimpico Soccer Stadium to cheer for Gremio Soccer team, in a terrible cold night of winter !!!! I hope that Waveplace extends its activities to South America soon, so you come to visit us again! I am sure we will keep working together and strength partnerships among organizations. As hardware gets less expensive, sooner or later laptops and other kinds of technology will arrive in schools all over. The need for software, knowledge, materials and guidance is growing and getting more evident, we all have tons of work to help technology improve education and children´s life, A good energy for all! Marta De: Timothy Falconer [mailto:teefal@squeakland.org] Enviada em: quinta-feira, 22 de abril de 2010 16:26 Para: squeakland(a)squeakland.org Assunto: stepping down from squeakland Hi everyone, After much soul searching, I've decided to step down as director of Squeakland Foundation. Since the earthquake in Haiti, my time has largely been spent on our Waveplace education pilots there, which have been very successful and are growing fast. Last night I decided that I need to stay focused on Haiti and our other Waveplace work, that I no longer have time for the additional responsibilities of Squeakland. I leave you in the very capable hands of Rita Freudenberg and whomever the new board decides. I still love Etoys, and will continue to teach it and promote it, though this will now be through Waveplace, not Squeakland. What has been called the "Squeakland Courseware" will now become the "Waveplace Courseware". Same stuff, different website. I will continue to fundraise for courseware development, this will be through Waveplace now. All materials will remain freely distributable. Immuexa, my software company, will continue to host and support the Squeakland website and showcase for free. Squeakland will now be our client, as Viewpoints was before. My very best to the many people I have meet in the last fifteen months. Thank you for your passion, your time, your talent. What a gift to work with such incredible people! Take care, Tim -- Timothy Falconer Squeakland Foundation http://squeakland.org <http://squeakland.org/> 610-797-3100 -- "Intelligence is what you use when you don't know what to do." ... piaget

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Join us for a sprint week before Squeakfest in July!
by Rita Freudenberg 24 Apr '10

24 Apr '10

Hi all, we are planning to have a one week sprint right before Squeakfest this year, from July, 17 - July 24. I would like to invite you to participate in this event! We plan to book a vacation home on a beach near Wilmington (NC), so that we can stay together, work, and have fun. There are no detailed plans yet about what exactly we will work on in this week. We could for example: - write an Etoys cookbook, a collection of tips & tricks about what you can do within Etoys - develop active essays within Etoys for certain subjects - develop introductional material for kids - have a "code sprint" - ... We are open for your ideas! What we will finally work on also depends on the experience of the participants of the sprint. Please let me know if you are interested in participating, since I have to do the booking soon. We cannot provide any financial support. If you have any ideas on how to get funding for this effort, let me know! Greetings, Rita

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Concurso Etoys y Scratch
by Carlos Rabassa 23 Apr '10

23 Apr '10

Tim, thank you very much for helping us with the publication of our gym class animation. We needed it to complete this page http://docs.google.com/View?id=dg7q79cx_552hcbdwbcp of the bilingual study guide we started a few months ago. We wanted to publish it now because we just saw the announcement of a contest of Etoys project in Uruguay. We thought this page and examples could encourage some children to enter the contest. In a recent posting we put some information about the context, if I read it correctly entries will be accepted from now up to June 15th.

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squeakland April 2010